Dominance Young Boars beginning to fight - please help

[slazy]

Hi All,

I've just registered here as I'm concerned about my little boys,

These are my first guinea pigs, we started with two a couple of months ago Munchy and Teemo (brothers from the same litter) and about a month after that we rescued our third piggy Buns as he was the only one in our local shelter and we didn't want to leave him alone,

At first we introduced Buns after about a week of being in a separate cage in the same rooms as the others, and the 3 of them got along great and were not fighting at all (other than occasional rumbling when they get in each others space)

Now Munchy has begun aggresively fighting Teemo - all three are fighting more than before, but their fights have become violent tumbles and launches towards each other - often with a mouth full of fur afterwards.

I have read that the general rule is if there is no bloodshed do not separate them, however I have separated Teemo from the other two as I don't think that would be far off,

Some other info;

I have them in a 2x3 C&C with a 1x2 loft
They are about 12-14 weeks old (is this puberty driven fights)

Can anyone please help as to what I should do in this situation?

Thankyou!

 

[lissie]

I would remove the loft and expand the cage if I were you. Three boars need a lot more space than a 2x3 cage. Can you expand to a 2x6 or a 3x4? Also change out any hidey house with only one entrance. Switch to fleece tents or fleece forests. Something they can run through and hide under. You'll need at least 4 hideys so each pig has their own, and plus an extra one.

Give them at least 2 places to eat, 2 piles of hay, 2 food dishes (preferably 3), and 3 water bottles.

 

[slazy]

Hi Lissie,

Thanks for your reply,

I don't think I can fit a 2x6 but a 3x4 should fit quite well,

We'll go buy some more houses tomorrow and replace the ones without two entrances / cut holes

I forgot to mention that when we put all three together, Munchy and Buns (One of the brothers and the new guinea) almost gang up on Teemo,

Is this something that may stop if they have more space and can have their own territory?

 

[barbaramudge]

Your cage is way to small for two boys let alone three. If you look at the main tab for size requirements for 3 bigs and then go the next size larger because they are boys you'll have the minimum size requirement. Wider is always better for boars. Multiple feeding stations and water bottles along with hides that have multiple exits. 3 boars is tough and puberty will make it worse. I'm certain more experienced members will have more advice. Good Luck!

 

[barbaramudge]

Sorry, don't know why the replies didn't show when I posted my response! Didn't mean to be redundant.

 

[slazy]

Thanks for the help all,

I spent most of yesterday making a new 2x5 cage (was unable to fit any longer or wider)

They are fighting much less, have still had a couple of fits but much better,

When they have floor time in their play pen however they rarely fight,

If I was going to put a loft in again, is it more appropriate to have two ramps so they cannot trap each other in that section?

Thanks again

Kind regards,
Lucas

 

[barbaramudge]

Well that's trickery because ramps take up floor space. I personally would make the loft wide instead. Say a 2x2 loft instead of a 1x2 loft. You can always add a second ramp if need be later.

 

[slazy]

This is the boys when they first met

In order from front;

Teemo, Munchy & Buns

 

[slazy]

This is the new cage I made yesterday (got some rad new fleece)

 

[barbaramudge]

Rad indeed

 

[foggycreekcavy]

I'd say no to a 1x2 loft. It's easy for pigs to get trapped up there. A 2x2 loft would be cool.

I'd remove the green and wooden houses for now. It would be easy for pigs to get trapped by others in there, which is usually when injuries occur. Your tunnel is pretty small, too (I always get the larger rabbit size-Amazon has some rainbow ones). You can always make some using cardboard boxes with doors cut into a couple of the sides. Or bend a grid and put fleece over the top.

I love your fleece!

Here are the Fiddle Sticks that I buy--
https://www.amazon.com/Kaytee-Tropi...&qid=1440604360&sr=8-7&keywords=fiddle+sticks

 

[Capricex]

Yea, good job! I would try putting a towel over one corner for a day or two (taking out everything else) allowing a hidey that's open though for all of them to use to maintain a constant open space that they have to share in the new cage. As they make a progression with the larger cage and mend relations, keeping it open takes away chances of power plays over the three for spots to claim. All three would have to bond and share the space under the towel with nothing to hold over the third. Then reintroduce everything once they seem to be more bonded.

 

[slazy]

Thanks Capricex! I'm giving that a go now,

I've taken out all the hideys and just put one towel in the corner,

They are still fighting a bit, and still biting each others fur in the process, just wondering how much is too much? And if it gets too bad should I separate the aggressor or the submissive piggy?

 

[lissie]

Put more towels in the cage. If you only put one, they will fight for that corner. Each pig needs his own hiding spot.

Edit to add: It was a good advice to remove the houses with only one door, since pigs can trap each other in there and cause fights. It was a bad advice to make them share the hiding space. They need their own space. They will work out their relationship if you give them time.

This is a good thread to read about boars introduction.
https://www.guinealynx.info/forums/viewtopic.php?t=46468

 

[slazy]

Hi All,

Just an update on the introductions, they are living together alot better now in the larger cage,

However;

I have noticed a few "bite marks" on Teemo,

He has a scab on his lip and one on his tummy and another under his fur on his back

I'm not 100% sure these are from bites but am quite sure, however they are not bleeding / I havent noticed them bleeding

Is this the point where they shuold be separated or should i persist and check regularly to make sure no further damage is done,

He doesnt seem injured or worried at all by the wounds, but ive read thats characteristic of all pigs

Is this normal behavior for 3 males going through puberty?

Thanks in advance, my new grids arrived today so I will expand the second level through the week

 

[lunarminx]

Good job on the cage, as someone that had 4 boars together, if at all possible, go 3 wide, it will make so much of a difference. Even when I had them in pairs, the best results were in a 3x3 over the 2x4 cage. The fighting is normal for puberty, that is why the wider the better, easier to get by without starting a fight.

For the old woulds, just watch them, I wouldn't separate them unless major blood is drawn or one is losing weight. I wouldn't do the loft, go wider and use some grids for a base maybe to have storage room under the cage. It will replace the space lost holding items.

 

[bpatters]

Just keep checking them for any deep bite wounds. Nips are perfectly normal.

However, a scab on the face probably means that he's either been cornered somewhere, or someone has cornered him, and the cornered pig has fought his way out. Make sure there are no hideys/ramps/corners in the cage where anybody can get trapped. If there are, rearrange until they've got the full run of the cage. Throw the hideys out if they don't all have two doors.

 

[bmt28]

Lofts caused more problems for 1 of my boar pairs, the other pair did just fine but they are brothers. Now I have no loft space and all is well in Guinea Pig land. If you want a loft I think the 2 wide would be cool. All 4 of my boars are much better after puberty, not sure if this mirrors others experience or not.

 

[slazy]

Hi guys,

Just an update. Last night we made the cage bigger to a 2x5, hopefully to give them more room to run. We've also bought 3 fleece tunnels for them to hide and run through and we've taken out the green hidey because it only has one hole.

I have however heard the two guinea pigs picking on Teemo again and during the fights, they seem to be pulling tuffs of hair out from Teemo, causing more scabs.

What do we do? The hair pulling definitely seems to be hurting Teemo and he also seems to be in pain when we try to investigate his scabs.

 

[bpatters]

You might want to have Teemo thoroughly checked out by a good vet. Guinea pigs seems to sense when something is "off" with a pig, and bullying by another pig should be considered as a red flag that something might be wrong with the pig that's being picked on. That's not universally true, but it happens often. And since Teemo seems to be on the receiving end of bullying by two other pigs, it would probably be good to have him evaluated.

If he's ok, and nothing is going on, you may want to try finding him another buddy that he could live with.