Looking for advice!

alisonhilyard · Dec 5, 2014

Greetings! I am reaching out to you fellow piggie lovers for some advice.....

I have 2 guinea pigs, Buddy and Brownie, who are almost 3 years old. I got them at the same time and they are brothers. All has been going great over the past 3 years w/out any issues. Well, the other day, I noticed Buddy seemed interested in food, but would sniff it and then not eat it. He went to the water bottle and didn't seem to be able to open his mouth to get any. So, I waited one more day and things didn't seem better so I took him to the vet. $135 later, I was told his temp was perfect, no issues with his mouth or teeth, no stomach problems and nothing seemed to be stuck. They cut his nails and gave me some meds to help with nausea and asked me to give him a liquid diet for the next 2-3 days. Buddy seems to be taking the meds and food OK, but he's not any better....thought he's not any worse, either. The doctor wanted to do a $400 x-ray (which would also involve sedating Buddy) and I said "no." I can't afford that and I am not willing to spend that much money for something that may or may not show anything.

So, now I am not sure what to do....they said if he doesn't get better over the next week, they either need to do more tests or it might be time to put him to sleep. I feel badly doing that because other than eating (except for what we are giving him in the syringe), he is acting pretty much the same. He moves around in his cage but isn't squeaking like he used to and hasn't pooped in a few days, probably because of the lack of food. Not sure if he's drinking, but it looks like he might have taken some. He sniffed the Romaine lettuce I gave him this morning and took a few small bites, but that is about it.

Any advice? Has anyone had this issue before? I am afraid the outcome is not good.....

Thanks in advance!

Alison

BaconAndEggs · Dec 5, 2014

I have never had this problem before, so I'm afraid my advice might not be too precise...

Did you separate your pigs? It may be easier to monitor how much he is eating and drinking. It could possibly be nausea, or maybe something is holding him back. Have you gone anywhere that may have left a strange scent on you? Did you happen to switch your veggie, pellet, hay, or water provider recently?

It could also possibly be blockage. This usually only happens in older boars, and he IS getting to that age. I'm guessing that this is also the same with hay, so try to really encourage it. One time my piggies ate part of a plastic bag, and I was told that the solution was to REALLY push the Timothy Hay. Keep a very close eye on him and if he seems to be trying to poop, but it won't come out, there is a pretty good chance it is blockage.

I hope he gets better soon, sending you hugs.

bpatters · Dec 5, 2014

Was this an exotic vet, or just a dog-and-cat vet? Because small animal (dog and cat) vets don't know much about guinea pigs. The fact that they gave you something for him for nausea makes me very suspicious, because guinea pigs are completely unable to vomit.

What sort of tooth exam did they do? Is Buddy able to eat anything at all? Can he pick up food and get it into his mouth?

What did they give you to feed him? And how much of it is he getting per day?

alisonhilyard · Dec 5, 2014

Yep, they are separated and I definitely took him to an exotic vet. Correct, the vet thinks it might be nausea, but nothing has changed in their diet. They both eat the same food, hay and veggies. I spoil them!

. He just doesn't seem interested in food but it's not like he's suffering or looking like he's dying. We are giving him a "liquid diet" and the package says its a "nutritionally complete, assist-feeding formula for herbivores." It almost looks like a veggie powder. You mix it with water and put it in a syringe. Buddy seems to like it and even licked the nozzle after I took it out of his mouth.

They gave me the anti-nausea because they can't vomit. They figured he might eat if he didn't have an upset tummy. Yes, he can pick up the food, he just doesn't seem to be interested in eating it. I am certain if we didn't "force feed" him, he would die. He lost weight in the 2 days before I could get him to the vet!

He's not pooping, but the vet didn't seem surprised since he wasn't eating. He has urninated, though. I would love to push the hay if he would eat it...he normally eats a LOT of it, but not now, though I have some in his cage.

The he vet said she doesn't think it is a blockage, but maybe that's what the $400 x-ray is for?

This is is the one time I wish guinea pigs could speak words!!

dani_starr · Dec 5, 2014

I'm confused to as why they would give you something to help with possible nausea, when guinea pigs can't vomit, and therefore I don't think they can experience nausea. Nausea is defined as "a feeling of sickness with an inclination to vomit." I'm pretty certain this means that guinea pigs don't experience this, since they are unable to vomit. They certainly can have a lack of appetite due to illness, but I don't think it can be defined as "nausea." Maybe I'm wrong on this though.

To me, it seems very weird that a vet would give you medicine for nausea or an "upset tummy." What is the name of the medicine they gave you to help with nausea? What does it say on the packaging?

Your sure it's nothing to do with his teeth? What did they do during the teeth exam?

Are you sure this exotic vet is experienced with guinea pigs? Not just willing to see them, but actually is knowledgeable? If you give us your city, we can help you find a good vet if you want

alisonhilyard · Dec 5, 2014

Yep, they did a full exam of the teeth and mouth using a special tool. Spent quite a good amount of time checking the things out..and Buddy wasn't happy about it! Apparently, Guinea pigs can have an upset tummy w/out wanting to vomit....kinda like how people feel when they feel 'blah" and just don't want to eat. The vet I saw is very experienced in guinea pigs. I know several people who went to her with excellent results. That's why it took me a few days to get an appointment!

Fay · Dec 6, 2014

How is his activity level? And is the food passing through? It could be a heart condition or an obstruction of some kind. You will probably need to get the x-ray to confirm as this doesn't sound like a thing easily fixed with some medication so try to figure out how you could pay for a potentially large vet bill. Maybe borrow some money of a friend or family member?

https://www.guinealynx.info/anorexia.html
https://www.guinealynx.info/heart.html

3GPigsplus1more · Dec 6, 2014

A thorough exam for teeth would require putting the guinea pig under anesthesia. Looking into the mouth will not give the vet a look into the back molars which may be causing Buddy not to eat. If he has his appetite and eating Critical care but he will not eat his hay and pellets this is a good indication that there is teeth issues.

alisonhilyard · Dec 6, 2014

Sorry, but I am not willing to spend $400 on an x-ray for a 3 yr old guinea pig. That is a huge cost and frankly I think overpriced. They did a pretty good exam of his mouth and said it all looked OK. I put Buddy back in his cage with Brownie this morning and he got perky and even tried to eat some hay, but again, looked like he physically couldn't do it. I am going to call the vet this morning and see if I can get another one to look at his teeth. I really think its the issue, so I am gong to get a 2nd opinion. We might have another exotic animal vet in a nearby town, so I am going to check that, too. This is ridiculous, because I think the problem is fixable!

3GPigsplus1more · Dec 6, 2014

You do not need an X-ray to do teeth exam unless you suspect root issues.

alisonhilyard · Dec 6, 2014

Thanks everyone! I am calling the vet when they open at 8am and will bring him back and sternly talk to the vet to get more action. I am fine with them giving him anesthesia to take a better look at his teeth...I am not a vet, but I really think that's the problem. He ate his liquid food theirs morning and doesn't look like he's losing weight, so maybe we'll be able to fix this. Stay tuned. You guys are awesome!

foggycreekcavy · Dec 6, 2014

Are you weighing him daily? It's the only way to know for sure if he's keeping his weight up.

I imagine that if his teeth looked good on inspection, the vet is concerned about a possible abscess or infection, or perhaps compacted roots, and these would only show up on an X-ray.

alisonhilyard · Dec 6, 2014

His weight is staying the same. She is not concerned about an infection or abcess....she said his front teeth are "a little long" but she didn't think (emphasis on THINK) they needed trimming. I disagree and think it's worth doing. Buddy is much happier in the cage with his brother than he was alone. The doctor doesn't think he has anything contagious so I am going to leave them together. I have an appt Monday morning. The exotic animal vet is not on the office today and the other clinic that treats guinea pigs is closed.

. We have plenty of liquid food to get him through Monday and we'll see how it goes from there. I'll keep trying to give him fresh veggies and there is lots of hay for him, too!

bpatters · Dec 6, 2014

Actually, @3GPigsplus1more, you DO need an x-ray to do a complete dental check. A visual exam will show overgrown molars, but if the problem is elongated roots, an abscess, or a joint defect, those won't show.

I agree that $400 for an x-ray is ridiculous. But I disagree that his front teeth are the problem. Problems with the front teeth are almost always due to problems with the molars in the back, unless the front teeth are wonky because of some root problem or injury. But in those cases, they're not uniform in length, and may not be straight. I definitely would not have my pigs' front teeth trimmed unless the vet also addressed the problem with the molars. Guinea pigs don't need regular tooth trimming like some other rodent types. Mine are 5+ years old, and neither has ever had a tooth trimming.

If he's having trouble eating, he's having trouble with his molars, or one or both of his jaw joints have problems (rare, but possible). But you need a good piggy dentist to plane his molars.

What kind of hay does he get, and how much of it? Hay is what keeps their molars ground down, as well as their guts moving. But some hays are better than others at doing that. And how many veggies and pellets does he get? Pigs can prefer pellets and veggies to hay, and not eat enough hay to do the job on their teeth.

ClemmyOddieIndy · Dec 6, 2014

alisonhilyard said:
Sorry, but I am not willing to spend $400 on an x-ray for a 3 yr old guinea pig. That is a huge cost and frankly I think overpriced.

It probably depends on where you are, but that is high for around here (Iowa). It's been a while since I've had to have an x-ray for a pig, but if I remember right is around around $130ish. I don't understand what you mean when you say "for a 3 year old guinea pig". He's not very old at 3 years.

I've never dealt with teeth issues so I can't be any help there. But, I would recommend starting a medical fund. I have a medical fund for my pigs and it's been extremely important. I've spent around $8,000 in the last two years on medical expenses for only two pigs. Guinea pigs are expensive little creatures, but oh so worth it.

ETA: I changed the amount I've spent. I realized I way did my math wrong, and I had to bring it down a bit.

Click to expand...

alisonhilyard · Dec 6, 2014

I give them timothy hay, orchard grass and oat hay and the bin in their cage is always full of one type. Buddy normally LOVES hay, but sniffs it now and won't eat it. We'll see what the doctor says on Monday. She did say the $400 x-ray was for a full body shot, which maybe we won't need if she only wants to do his mouth. However, the other day she didn't think it was necessary. I am hoping she's just not trying to get me to keep coming back to get more $$ out of me, but it's the only exotic pet hospital in the area and it has a really good reputation.

I am very sorry, but I am a big animal lover and want to do what is best for them, but for a 5 "ish" year life span and there is no way I would ever spend what you did on my guinea pigs. I don't like to put a value on an animal's life, but I am not even sure I would spend that much on any animal. If it's costing $12,000, it would seem to me that something is wrong to the point that I wouldn't want the animal to suffer. For instance, my friend spent $6,000 on her dog to treat it for cancer. The dog was extremely sick during that time and died quickly, anyway. She felt tremendous guilt afterwards for all the "suffering" it went through for nothing. I would never do that to my animal. I would rather him leave this world peacefully than fighting for its life. If it gets to that point with Buddy, then that is a decision I will have to make. It hurts me and makes me sick to my stomach, but I will do what's right for him. I give your props for loving your piggies so much that you would spend a large amount of money on them, but for me, it is not an option.

3GPigsplus1more · Dec 6, 2014

@bpatters, I am looking at this case individually. I would start with a more thorough exam with anesthetic and do any necessary trims. Once the vet looks at the mouth and suspects other issues I would then do the X-ray. @$400 I would not start with the X-ray, only to find out it was unnecessary. Without an X-ray my a vet is able to see signs of abscess and joint defect and then he would go ahead to do the X-ray to confirm. I would also do the X-ray if he continues not eating and all else looks well, if it still looks like it could be teeth issues.

bpatters · Dec 6, 2014

@3GPigsplus1more, but you didn't make your statement applicable to an individual case. You just made a general statement that x-rays aren't necessary to do tooth exams unless you suspect something else, and that's not the case.

People depend on this forum for accurate advice. Many of them are very young, and not skilled at understanding when something is an individual case or a general case, and they tend to be very literal in applying advice. It would be helpful if you'd be more specific about what you're recommending, and under what circumstances.

ClemmyOddieIndy · Dec 6, 2014

alisonhilyard said:
I give them timothy hay, orchard grass and oat hay and the bin in their cage is always full of one type. Buddy normally LOVES hay, but sniffs it now and won't eat it. We'll see what the doctor says on Monday. She did say the $400 x-ray was for a full body shot, which maybe we won't need if she only wants to do his mouth. However, the other day she didn't think it was necessary. I am hoping she's just not trying to get me to keep coming back to get more $$ out of me, but it's the only exotic pet hospital in the area and it has a really good reputation.

I am very sorry, but I am a big animal lover and want to do what is best for them, but for a 5 "ish" year life span and there is no way I would ever spend what you did on my guinea pigs. I don't like to put a value on an animal's life, but I am not even sure I would spend that much on any animal. If it's costing $12,000, it would seem to me that something is wrong to the point that I wouldn't want the animal to suffer. For instance, my friend spent $6,000 on her dog to treat it for cancer. The dog was extremely sick during that time and died quickly, anyway. She felt tremendous guilt afterwards for all the "suffering" it went through for nothing. I would never do that to my animal. I would rather him leave this world peacefully than fighting for its life. If it gets to that point with Buddy, then that is a decision I will have to make. It hurts me and makes me sick to my stomach, but I will do what's right for him. I give your props for loving your piggies so much that you would spend a large amount of money on them, but for me, it is not an option.

Who said they live 5ish years? They can live up to 9. My oldest is 5.5 at the moment with no health problem (except she's overweight). One of my vets has said the average age she sees them live to is 7.

Neither of my pigs were suffering, they just had chronic medical conditions. One had an enlarged heart that required monthly cardiology appointments. Chronic medical conditions are not rare in guinea pigs. Once they get sick it tends to just snowball. I was raised that when you commit to an animal you commit to that animal. I would never put an animal to sleep or deny my animal medical care it needed because of money. I would make that money doing whatever I needed to do, because that's part of being a responsible owner. I don't know much about teeth problems, but I know they can be chronic so I'd start saving if I were you.

Lewis3265 · Dec 6, 2014

IMO I am surprised they didn't offer to do blood work to find out what might be wrong with him. I would say, take him to another vet.

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