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Rescuing, Buying, Breeding

PinnyGig said:
If you are taking the best care of your pet that you are able to THAT is what is really important.
No, what is important is that you take the best care of your animals THAT is in their best interests. If you take on the responsibility of any animal, you should always do what is in the best interest of that particular animal.
 
I agree, if you guys claim to "Love" guinea pigs soooooo much, then why won't you guys save an innocent guinea pig from a pet store,

Ya you guys adopted your pigs from a rescue, but where the hell do you think that pig came from.. either a pet store, or a breeder..

And here's MY 0.02 Cents..

VoodooJoint, I think you're an :censored:hole.
 
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I agree, if you guys claim to "Love" guinea pigs soooooo much, then why won't you guys save an innocent guinea pig from a pet store,

Ya you guys adopted your pigs from a rescue, but where the hell do you think that pig came from.. either a pet store, or a breeder..

And here's MY 0.02 Cents..

VoodooJoint, I think you're an :censored:hole.
I think you're quite rude.
Anyways, they are doing something by not supporting the people who sells those poor guinea pigs.
What are you doing to save them? Buying two? Please, there is many more thousands out there suffering.
 
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I think you're quite rude.
Anyways, they are doing something by not supporting the people who sells those poor guinea pigs.
What are you doing to save them? Buying two? Please, there is many more thousands out there suffering.

Im rude?!

Maybe you should read VoodooJoints post again.

I couldn't care less what you think of me.

I won't be coming on here again, that's for sure.

And as for buying the ones who are suffering? The ones in the pet stores are suffering, You claim to be Guinea pig lovers? No you're not, you can't call yourselves that, you can't even save a helpless guinea pig from a pet store. A guinea pig is a guinea pig, no matter what. You should all be ashamed of yourself.
 
Im rude?!

Maybe you should read VoodooJoints post again.

I couldn't care less what you think of me.

I won't be coming on here again, that's for sure.

And as for buying the ones who are suffering? The ones in the pet stores are suffering, You claim to be Guinea pig lovers? No you're not, you can't call yourselves that, you can't even save a helpless guinea pig from a pet store. A guinea pig is a guinea pig, no matter what. You should all be ashamed of yourself.
I did buy two guinea pigs from a pet store before I knew how my dear pigs were born. Their poor mother was probably bred back to back before she died suffering due to no vet care. That is how pet store guinea pigs are born.
Therefore, I now choose to adopt the other unwanted pets out there who is dumped by their owners, who bought them from a pet store.
You can't save all the guinea pigs out there. I'm sorry. What you can do is prevent the cruelty, though. That's the point of this website.
 
I agree, if you guys claim to "Love" guinea pigs soooooo much, then why won't you guys save an innocent guinea pig from a pet store,

Ya you guys adopted your pigs from a rescue, but where the hell do you think that pig came from.. either a pet store, or a breeder..

And here's MY 0.02 Cents..

VoodooJoint, I think you're an asshole.


Wow :eye-poppi I have to say I agree with helping the petstore pigs.
 
You don't "save" petstore pigs when you purchase them. All you are doing is enabling more to be bred to take their place, causing sows to be backbred over and over and causing a vicious and cruel cycle to continue.

By rescuing a pig from a shelter/rescue or getting a pig that needs to be rehomed from other methods such as craigslist, rescue friendly website ads or from your local papers does NOT cause more pigs to be bred and does not cause pigs to die in that process. There is a huge difference but some people just REFUSE to open their eyes and see the large scale picture behind the scenes.
 
In perfect world, there would be no unwanted animals. People would all be responsible and take good care of their pets.
In a perfect world, no humans would suffer either. there would be no orphans, no one living in poverty. no wives abused by their husbands, or children by their parents. There would be no War, no murder, no rape.

But we do not live in a perfect world. Humans are not perfect. We can strive for betterness, but perfection is an unattainable state.

As Ojars said, the cat has no idea what happens to it when it gets spayed. it knows that it goes to a strange place that smells of chemicals and blood, its is pricked with something sharp, falls alseep, and when it wakes up it is in terrible pain, which lasts for quite some time. I imagine that many animals are quite horrified by what has happened. But they don't dwell on it... they get on with their lives as best as they can, and within time the memery fades. Spaying and Neutering is done for human convienece. We advocate it because it helps keep down animal populations, which is good. no one can feed and care for all the animals that are born into this world.

Life is hard, for people and for animals. Many of our pets have better lives than millions of people in this world. Do people who live in less than ideal conditions lead abusive lives? I know a woman who fed a family of 6 on less than $100 a week.All their clothing came from goodwill or the salvation army. Her van was repossesed one day as she was picking up her children from school. ( she made them follow her home so she could get the kids home before she let them take it. the kids had no idea). But they were still a happy family. her children have grown into happy, healthy, well adjusted teenagers, the eldest has his own house now. They came from conditions that no one would call "ideal", but they have thrived.

overpopulation problems come when animals breed in greater numbers than can be supported. In nature, there are predators and other factors which take care of this. The infant mortality rate of most bears is 50%. That means one in two bear cubs never makes it to adulthood. But most environments cannot sustain more than a few bears, so it works out. If something happened and all cubs began to live to adulthood, within a few generations the bears would have completely decimated their habitat, and all would starve. Nature takes care of it itself, albeit in harsh ways. There is no overpopulation of cats in the rural areas where i live. yes, many are unneutered and breed prolifically, as their hormoines and instincts tell them too. But there are also plenty of coyotes, and most of these cats don't live past a few years. This is natural, as horrible as we may find it. this is how the environment sustains itself, and how it functions.
human interference results in lower infant mortaility rates. because of our interference, we must be respnsible to ensure these animals are cared for properly and lead long happy lives. Spaying and neutering our pets ensures that we do not overpopulate the pet pupolation to levels that we cannot sustain.

I will say again, the barn cat is NOT a pet. She serves a purpose, as rodent control, and is both necessary and happy in this role. Most farmers don't have pets, they have useful animals...cats to keep mice populations down, watchdogs, etc. Her owners have been very responsible in her care... making sure she always has food for when she can't catch mice, finding homes for her children, neutering their other cat. I know it is harsh, but the reality is that she could be killed at any time, by a car or a coyote or another animal. The nearest intact male cat lives over a mile away, when she is in heat she goes to seek him out.

I think we need to stop judging people so much for what they do or do not do to their pets and focus on the actaul welfare of the animal. If I told you that i have a horse who lives outdoors all year , even when the temperature drops to -45 and there is a blizzard, would you say that is cruel? many people would. he wears no blankets, although he does have a shelter to stop the wind. I'm sure you're thinking that he should be put into a box stall on days when it is that cold, or at least given a blanket. But he rips blankets off, and is terrified of box stalls. So when it is that cold, we put extra starw in the shelter for insulation, give them extra food to compensate for energy lost trying to keep warm, and he does fine. He is happy and excited about the extra food, and stays warm cuddled in the shelter with his mare.
Just because someone does something differnt, doesn't mean they are doing it wrong.
As long as animals are recieving good care and living happy, healthy lives, is that not what really matters?

I think we need to get off our self-riteous moral moral high-horses and focus on helping people give the best care to their animals, not judging them when they don 't measure up to your standards.
 
i can take the heat

you do not have the power to offend me, only i have to the power to be offended by you, and i am not. You cannot forcibly change someone's way of thinking, you can only control yourself. It is both pointless and cruel to try and force your beliefs on others, especially by attacking their moral qualities and bringing their character into question. This is a ploy used by bad politicians and bullies, not rational, open minded adults.
 
There were 10 guinea pigs available at the local(edmonton) humane society 2 days ago, there are currently at least 13 guineapigs posted locally on Kijiji as well. If you are looking locally for pigs.
The local humane society also has a barn cats program to adopt out healthy, fixed, cats to barn homes if they are not able to be litter trained. It is not necessary to breed barn cats, there are lots available to replace any that get eaten or run over.
 
thank you! the only primary sources for guinea pigs are pet stores or breeders! even if you adopt all of your pigs, they started off, or their parents started off, at a pet store or breeder.

Yes we should all endeavour to adopt unwanted pets, but if we get the stores to stop selling them, and people to stop breeding them, then there will be none to adopt!
 
Many spay clinics and rescues have programs for feral cats and barn cats to be captured, if wild, fixed, and released for FREE. I help my uncle do this because in my neighborhood there is a woman who refuses or can't pay for her cats to get neutered. I've called the humane society and they said they cant seize her cat's because she doesn't want to get rid of them and they don't live in her house at all times. So every summer there's a new batch of kittens around that I get fixed, and TRY to re home as many as I can. But many don't find any homes besides this woman down the street. She hates me to pieces and has yelled at me for getting them fixed because as part of the program the tip of their ears are clipped off and for getting rid of some of her favorite cats. They can't feel it and it doesn't bother them because its cartilage and they don't have very much nerves in the ears and most of the cats that come from her are feral and are very hard to socialize. The average life span of outdoor cats are two years, but in those two years you can make sure their not causing other cats to live this way. Just because the animal lives outside and won't live very long doesn't mean that they shouldn't have a good quality of life. And as for your rescue horror stories, if people got their animal... whats the word?.... NEUTERED?! The rescues wouldn't be so damn over populated that they can't always spot health problems and give attention these animals deserve, so because of breeding we come full circle. Since I've been "altering these animals for my convince" the number of stray cats in my area has decreased greatly. There is NO good reason for adding more wood to the fire of animal overpopulation.

If the animal isn't on the endangered species list or isn't going to be, why make more? The animal you think you rescuing at a pet store is just going to be replaced. I know they look sad, but your not helping anything. Your enabling pet stores to get more animals, and add to the number of more homeless and abused animals.
 
I know there are local guinea pigs for adoption. At the humane society some of them are called itchy, scratchy, funzo... simpsons names. i have been checking. I also have seen the kijiji pigs, most of whom were bred by hobbyists (which you all also seem to dissaprove of). The thing is, None of these is the kind I want. I want a short haired, female guinea pig. is that too much to ask? the general consensus in the forums is that females tend to smell a little less, and are a little more docileI. I have always had female pigs, that i what i want. I want a short haired one because my place is very small and the last thing i need is tons of guine pig hair all over the place, short hair is a little easier to manage. I have not gotten a pig yet because there hasn't been the right one available for adoption! i have been to the pet store at least twice in the last week, but i did not buy any of those pigs because i would rather adopt one. so i am waiting for the right one.

And i know about the barn buddies program as well. when my mother in law's cats do die, which hopefully won't be for a while, i am going to recomend that she get her next one from there instead.

I am not advocating breeding barn cats! i am simply saying that just because someone lets it happen does not mean they are being cruel. Both the barn cats are well taken care of, and very happy. no one who sees these cats would say they are being abused in any way. you should not judgewhen you do not know the whole story. Who gives you the right to judge anybody anyways? are you perfect?
 
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I will say again, the barn cat is NOT a pet. She serves a purpose, as rodent control, and is both necessary and happy in this role. Most farmers don't have pets, they have useful animals...cats to keep mice populations down, watchdogs, etc. Her owners have been very responsible in her care... making sure she always has food for when she can't catch mice, finding homes for her children, neutering their other cat. I know it is harsh, but the reality is that she could be killed at any time, by a car or a coyote or another animal. The nearest intact male cat lives over a mile away, when she is in heat she goes to seek him out.

Working animals deserve to be taken care of as well. I don't know of any conscientious farmer who allows dogs and cats to roam around their farms unvaccinated (endangering both their animals and other animals) and unspayed, having litter after litter. Why did your mother even bother neutering the male, since he may be killed at any time? :rolleyes:

It is disgusting that you would actually try to justify a poor cat living out doors, having litter after litter after litter as "ok", simply because your mother is too lazy to have her spayed and too apathetic to worry about creating a haven for her where she can't be ripped apart by coyotes.

The reality is, it is cruel to ignore the needs of an animal because it is not "economical" to take care of them because they will be killed due to your own unwillingness to provide them with a safe place.

If you would give me your location, I would find the nearest spay and neuter clinic, and would be willing to donate to get this poor animal fixed. A stranger, that has never met this animal, feels like it is important enough to be cared for.
 
It's rather hypocritical of you to be lecturing on animal welfare considering how you "care" for the animals in your family and the ones you don't see a problem buying from pet stores to support breeding mills, the pet mill industry and backyard breeders.

In perfect world, there would be no unwanted animals. People would all be responsible and take good care of their pets.
In a perfect world, no humans would suffer either. there would be no orphans, no one living in poverty. no wives abused by their husbands, or children by their parents. There would be no War, no murder, no rape.

But we do not live in a perfect world. Humans are not perfect. We can strive for betterness, but perfection is an unattainable state.

As Ojars said, the cat has no idea what happens to it when it gets spayed. it knows that it goes to a strange place that smells of chemicals and blood, its is pricked with something sharp, falls alseep, and when it wakes up it is in terrible pain, which lasts for quite some time. I imagine that many animals are quite horrified by what has happened. But they don't dwell on it... they get on with their lives as best as they can, and within time the memery fades. Spaying and Neutering is done for human convienece. We advocate it because it helps keep down animal populations, which is good. no one can feed and care for all the animals that are born into this world.

Life is hard, for people and for animals. Many of our pets have better lives than millions of people in this world. Do people who live in less than ideal conditions lead abusive lives? I know a woman who fed a family of 6 on less than $100 a week.All their clothing came from goodwill or the salvation army. Her van was repossesed one day as she was picking up her children from school. ( she made them follow her home so she could get the kids home before she let them take it. the kids had no idea). But they were still a happy family. her children have grown into happy, healthy, well adjusted teenagers, the eldest has his own house now. They came from conditions that no one would call "ideal", but they have thrived.

overpopulation problems come when animals breed in greater numbers than can be supported. In nature, there are predators and other factors which take care of this. The infant mortality rate of most bears is 50%. That means one in two bear cubs never makes it to adulthood. But most environments cannot sustain more than a few bears, so it works out. If something happened and all cubs began to live to adulthood, within a few generations the bears would have completely decimated their habitat, and all would starve. Nature takes care of it itself, albeit in harsh ways. There is no overpopulation of cats in the rural areas where i live. yes, many are unneutered and breed prolifically, as their hormoines and instincts tell them too. But there are also plenty of coyotes, and most of these cats don't live past a few years. This is natural, as horrible as we may find it. this is how the environment sustains itself, and how it functions.
human interference results in lower infant mortaility rates. because of our interference, we must be respnsible to ensure these animals are cared for properly and lead long happy lives. Spaying and neutering our pets ensures that we do not overpopulate the pet pupolation to levels that we cannot sustain.

I will say again, the barn cat is NOT a pet. She serves a purpose, as rodent control, and is both necessary and happy in this role. Most farmers don't have pets, they have useful animals...cats to keep mice populations down, watchdogs, etc. Her owners have been very responsible in her care... making sure she always has food for when she can't catch mice, finding homes for her children, neutering their other cat. I know it is harsh, but the reality is that she could be killed at any time, by a car or a coyote or another animal. The nearest intact male cat lives over a mile away, when she is in heat she goes to seek him out.

I think we need to stop judging people so much for what they do or do not do to their pets and focus on the actaul welfare of the animal. If I told you that i have a horse who lives outdoors all year , even when the temperature drops to -45 and there is a blizzard, would you say that is cruel? many people would. he wears no blankets, although he does have a shelter to stop the wind. I'm sure you're thinking that he should be put into a box stall on days when it is that cold, or at least given a blanket. But he rips blankets off, and is terrified of box stalls. So when it is that cold, we put extra starw in the shelter for insulation, give them extra food to compensate for energy lost trying to keep warm, and he does fine. He is happy and excited about the extra food, and stays warm cuddled in the shelter with his mare.
Just because someone does something differnt, doesn't mean they are doing it wrong.
As long as animals are recieving good care and living happy, healthy lives, is that not what really matters?

I think we need to get off our self-riteous moral moral high-horses and focus on helping people give the best care to their animals, not judging them when they don 't measure up to your standards.
 
How do you people think cats survive in the wild? cats are one of the few domesticated animals which can actually survive in the wild with absolutely no intervention from humans. Millions of years of evolution has turned them into very self sufficient creatures. There are thousands of feral cats in the worl, and most of them do just fine. just because they eat mice instead of specially formulated kibble, and sleep under a bush instead of under a bed, doesn't mean that they don't leave rich and healthy lives. my mother in law's cats are both very happy and well adjusted. i know many indoor cats who are not as well adjusted, because they are forced to live in a sitiuation that is contrary to their nature. their instincts say hunt, pounce, catch, but there is nothing for them to do that too. The outdoor cats can fulfill their instinctive drives much better than indoor ones can, and this makes most of them very happy.

I will say again, I am not oppsed to adpotion of unwanted animals, or to spaying or neutering pets. I support these things! what i am saying is, what gives anybody the right to judge another human being, especially when do do not fully understand all the circumstances of the situation.

Only the gods may judge me
 
VoodooJoint, I think you're an :censored:hole.
Thank you! Something like that, coming from someone like you, is one of the best things you could say. Maybe next you could call me a humaniac, or a tree-hugger!
 
This is a ploy used by bad politicians and bullies, not rational, open minded adults.
You are being neither rational nor open minded. You refuse to see and accept the bigger picture. Instead you stamp your feet, shake your head, plug your ears and shout, "I can't hear you, I can't hear you", over and over.

Saying that the cat is a working animal is not an excuse for neglectful ownership. I can pretty much guarantee that the laws in your area say you are not allowed to have an unaltered, unvaccinated cat outside of a
containment. If the law was to be enforced you would be fined because the property occupants would, without a doubt, be recognized as the legal owners of that cat.

By the way, None of your posts will be approved unless you can come up with some new material. Children repeat themselves over and over, not rational adults. No one is interested in continually going around and around with your twisted little logic. It's a waste of time.
 
I agree with Voodoo 100%. Your not listening, and if you are your doing a very poor job of it.
 
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