Pet Stores Petco

[wonderwhiskers]

That they have to pay employee wages and other costs of operating a business is a moot point. Every business has to put out money to make money. The point is they are selling these animals for less than they paid to acquire them.

Pet stores in America have to pay vet bills for the sick animals they are selling too, when they opt for veterinary care instead of something more convenient ... It's the price of doing business.

Beyond that, one of the reasons stores sell animals is that they serve as an impulse buy that's a gateway to selling more products - cages, accessories, food, etc. - which results in more profit for the store.

That some workers took note of the loss of your cat and helped with your blind dog is great, but nothing more than the generosity of those workers.

I can certainly appreciate that you've come to respect and appreciate this store and its staff. That doesn't change the fact that they continue to sell animals instead of encouraging adoption at a local shelter or rescue.

It makes no difference. They are still creating lives while others are homeless in shelters.

I disagree. If they are selling animals, they are just as bad. That there may be some points that are better than stores in other countries doesn't change that fact.

In what way have you been harassed or criticized for anything that has to do with your animals?

Well no, as I said in a past post .. they're animals are all taken in and 'sold' .. the rescues around here are very limited. So many small animals get turned away ..this petshop takes them, and unwanted babies in, therefor they are not creating lives ..just trying to protect lives caused by other peoples ignorance.
What would happen to these animals if the petshop didnt act as a gatestop for them? They would be chucked onto the streets, or killed.
Not everyone has the same love and respect for animals as us on this site.
I volunteer at a shelter, and I have seen first hand that at times it gets so crowded, new animals can't be taken in without compromising the health and happiness of the animals already there. It does'nt seem fair, but theres only so much we can do.

Yes, I understand all businesses need to make money, but I don't mind spending money in this shop on products for my animals - If i did'nt and the shop closed, where would the animals they take in and sell go? It isnt perfect .. but its better then nothing.

Yes, they are just as bad for selling animals ..as one life is worth exactly the same as another ..
BUT, what I meant by not as bad ..was the conditions were better. The animals are well-kept.
I never once said the shops are perfect and I would buy animals for them ..infact quite the opposite, but they are better then other countries.
Not perfect ..but were on our way.
Every day animal welfare is improved. And I'm proud to be a part of that.

I have'nt been critisised for how I look after my pets, and I never said I ha been. What I said was that it would be very offensive to be critisised for it, just because I pointed out some positive aspects on the pet shops here.

 

[Paula]

No way! My guinea pig, dewey, is very healthy and he's from Petco.

If he is indeed healthy, you're quite lucky. These Petco animals that weren't so fortunate:

Petco
Petco guinea pig dead of serious infection
Petco GP sold with URI dies
Petco bought pigs keep dying
Petco lied about GPs being spayed/neutered. Female GP dies of unknown cause 3 months after purchase
Petco pig sold sick. Taken back to store for treatment
Petco will do anything to make a sale
Petco Missexing
Sick Petco Pig and Rats
(broken link removed)
Inside Petco
Petco pig passes, infects owner's previous guinea pig with URI
Pregnant petco sow, both babies pass, one was a lethal
sick Petco pig passes
another sick Petco pig
petco pig passes
Petco pig has two babies, possible lethal white newborn passes
Another Petco pig has surprise babies
Petco pig with URI
more sick Petco pigs
Petco pig with URI
sick Petco pig , companion possibly missexed
Petco pig with URI, owner given Baytril without a prescription
sneezing Petco pig
Petco employee notes the guinea pigs have lice, manager unconcerned
Petco pig losing hair
pregnant Petco pig births two stillborns
Petco pig near death, they decline to take him back
Another sick Petco pig
lethargic Petco pig
Petco pig deteriorates a few weeks after purchase
Petco pig passes a few weeks after purchase
Petco pig passes, infects owner's previous guinea pig with URI
recurring URI in Petco pig
Petco pig diagnosed with fungus
Petco pig diagnosed with URI
Petco pig with lice
Petco pig gives birth
Petco pig with abscess
Neglected guinea pig from Petco passes
Petco pig with URI, Petco gives poor advice
young Petco baby with mites
sick Petco pig
Guinea pig with URI, Petco says it's a hairball
(broken link removed)
Surprise Birth from Petco Pig
Young Male bought at Petco Gives Birth
Petco Bought Pigs Both Have URIs

You can read the whole list of pet store horrors in this thread, thanks to VoodooJoint.

 

[Paula]

Wonderwhiskers - you're missing the points that I have tried to make. Perhaps in time, you'll be able to understand the much bigger issue of pet stores selling animals while others die in shelters, many of which have ended up there because of the very stores selling the animals to begin with. The handful of stores you've had exposure to can't possibly give you any real world sense of the horrors that go on in pet stores around the world. As Ly pointed out, you haven't seen the 'back rooms' or the conditions in which these animals live beyond your view of them in the pet store's showrooms. Maybe some day you'll have the misfortune of seeing the true cruelties involved in selling living beings as stock. Until that happens I can't see any reason to continue this argument with you.

 

[wonderwhiskers]

ETA:
I can appreciate a situation like this, but suspect that it's an isolated incident and due to the care and concern of an individual worker and most certainly not store policy.


I find your interpretation questionable. In any case, workers wouldn't be put in a situation to refuse to sell an animal to anyone if the store they worked for didn't offer them for sale in the first place.

I disagree. I have seen so many people be turned down from wanting to buy a pet.
Perhaps it is just the area I live in, but it was not an isolated incident.

As for your second point, I agree that animals should'nt be treated as 'merchandise' that can be easily disposed of ..but the fact of the matter is that animals ARE being sold as pets.
Its not right, but its not going to go away either, and personally I think we should be putting all our efforts into IMPROVING conditions, and making the lifes of the animals as best as possible, and eventually we will be able to get rid of shops, breeders and mills altogether.
This is a huge problem, and will not go away overnight, so bit by bit and step by step is our best bet.

 

[PiggieMom]

If i did'nt and the shop closed, where would the animals they take in and sell go? It isnt perfect .. but its better then nothing.

When people stop buying dogs and cats from pet stores that meant that there's that much less breeding, which means less animals will end up abused and abandoned in shelters and rescues. That's the whole point.

There's a bigger picture that I think you're completely missing. One pet store is not better than another. Support one, and you support the entire breeding ideology and economy. Buying from one store that treats their animals 'well' is just as horrible as buying from one that is abusive and negligent because you are supporting the idea that it is okay to breed, sell and purchase living beings.

 

[wonderwhiskers]

Wonderwhiskers - you're missing the points that I have tried to make. Perhaps in time, you'll be able to understand the much bigger issue of pet stores selling animals while others die in shelters, many of which have ended up there because of the very stores selling the animals to begin with. The handful of stores you've had exposure to can't possibly give you any real world sense of the horrors that go on in pet stores around the world. As Ly pointed out, you haven't seen the 'back rooms' or the conditions in which these animals live beyond your view of them in the pet store's showrooms. Maybe some day you'll have the misfortune of seeing the true cruelties involved in selling living beings as stock. Until that happens I can't see any reason to continue this argument with you.

Paula, You are missing the point I'm trying to make.
I'm not naive enough to think that what goes on behind closed pet shop doors is all happy and fluffy animal fun.
But if you read my posts, you'll see that what I'm talking about is the petshops in England. The ones I've personally seen. Which you, with all due respect cannot judge because you haven't been there.
As a whole, I am against, totally against petshops ..as I have said time and time again, post after post. What I am saying, is that our petshops, here .. the ones I have seen, are alot better then the ones around the world, that I have heard horror stories of.
I have not passed judgement on any shop I have been in. I have'nt said how awful they are, or how wonderful they are. I have just said that from what I have heard, the ones in my area treat their animals with alot of respect, and do look after them properly.
Please remeber the laws over here are different, and we are pro-animal rights in this country. For example, Fox hunting was recently banned. Finally. Every day we are making new developments, and everyday animal welfare gets better and better.
While the problem of over crowding is'nt going to end while petshops exist .. we should first concentrate on making the lives of petshop animals happy and healthy. Which, compare to American petshops ..are pretty good. We do have standererds, even if there is still alot of room for improvement ..we are one step closer every day to getting there.
Also, Petshops here don't sell cats or dogs, and there is still a huge over-population problem, so petshops can't be at fault for that .. It is breeders and accidental litters and all the other irresponsible people.

As for your comment about me one day being misfortunate enough to see the horrors of living beings being sold as stock ..
I already have, and I think it was a bit hypocritcal of you to assume I haven't.
As I have before, I volunteer at an RSPCA ..Alot of the small animals we have had in have been from petshops and the children get bored.
The usual.
I have seen poor animals neglected, claws overgrown, fur matted, horrible diets, pregnant pigs too old to give birth without seriosuly hurting themselves.

As a child I used to also help at a local donkey sanctuary, and the things I saw there were just as horrific, if not worse, yet petshops don't sell donkeys.

We need to spent more time educating people on the moral rights and wrongs. Perhaps that would be more efficiant in eliminating petshops, and ultimatly animal abuse and neglect.

 

[wonderwhiskers]

When people stop buying dogs and cats from pet stores that meant that there's that much less breeding, which means less animals will end up abused and abandoned in shelters and rescues. That's the whole point.

There's a bigger picture that I think you're completely missing. One pet store is not better than another. Support one, and you support the entire breeding ideology and economy. Buying from one store that treats their animals 'well' is just as horrible as buying from one that is abusive and negligent because you are supporting the idea that it is okay to breed, sell and purchase living beings.

Selling cats and dogs in petshops over here is illegal. It's not done, and if it was, not only would the law stop it, people would be outraged. We are as a whole nation, animals lovers.


I do not support petshops. I have already said this.
Looking at the bigger picture .. things have to improve gradually.
Imagine it as a timeline .. one day animals in petshops conditions get better. New laws are past which state certain requirements must be met for a petshop to be running. (GOOD, satisfactory requirements ..not the load of rubbish there is today).
Day 2, Potential owners must meet certain requirements, and must prove they do meet these requirements. (e.g a homecheck)
Day 3, animals cannot be bred, but only be rehomed on behalf of people who have had accidental litters, or animals that cannot be looked after by their old owners.

See? It would turn more into the pet shop I go to 45 mins away .. More like a rescue really! That sells supplies of course.

It wont happen over night .. but its what we should aim for!
Look at the bigger picture, not what we can do today or tomorrow .. but what we can perhaps reach in a few years!

 

[wonderwhiskers]

There is still just as much overpopulation of cats and dogs as there was years ago.
In fact, the RSPCA just releasted statistics showing there has been an INCREASE in the amount of cats and dogs abandoned or signed over to rescues, most likely because of the credit crunch.

 

[PiggieMom]

Again, you're missing the point of the dog and cat example. In the US major pet chains have, years ago, stopped selling cats and dogs because of the efforts of the consumer. These efforts were as simple as refusing to purchase cats and dogs from pet stores. It was simple and effective. Yes, I believe that pet stores should be constantly checked to assure they are at least caring for the animals they have. But I also believe there is no reason to not immediately convince people to not purchase animals. You're adding in unnecessary steps into the process. Convincing people to not purchase from pet stores is a proven method. It works. There's no reason to 'take it slow'.

 

[wonderwhiskers]

Again, you're missing the point of the dog and cat example. In the US major pet chains have, years ago, stopped selling cats and dogs because of the efforts of the consumer. These efforts were as simple as refusing to purchase cats and dogs from pet stores. It was simple and effective. Yes, I believe that pet stores should be constantly checked to assure they are at least caring for the animals they have. But I also believe there is no reason to not immediately convince people to not purchase animals. You're adding in unnecessary steps into the process. Convincing people to not purchase from pet stores is a proven method. It works. There's no reason to 'take it slow'.

I'm glad cats and dogs are no longer sold in the major chain pet shops.
I really do understand what your saying - everyone should just not use petshops that sell live animals. In an ideal world, this would be great. Nothing would make me happier.
But in reality .. average joe is too lazy to come onto sites like this, and find out why you should'nt buy from a petshop.
Average joe does'nt care how big a cage should be, or what makes his animals happy. He just wants the instant graification on his pet. (Or more likely his childrens new pet).
So what I'm saying is why can't we put pressure on the goverment, to put pressure on everyone else to MAKE the average person have to meet certain requirements. Its the only way this problem will ever be resolved .. because most people don't care enough to find out, and sort out this problem for themselves.
Convincing people not to buy from petshops is great, and it is a proven method -for those people who actually care enough to listen.
Or to take the time to come on here and do their own research.
But what about everyone else? I want to make it so that they HAVE to be the best owner that they can. Legally. Or face punishment.
And while we're at it ..why not put in the effort and make sure the lives of the poor animals who do end up in a petshop is happy and healthy?

 

[PiggieMom]

I think you're assuming that all the members of this forum do is post here and tell people to not buy from petshops. There are many of us that are active in petitioning, writing letters to our local, state and national government, participating in protests, writing store owners, reporting abuse to different authorities, running education programs, volunteering at shelters, running rescues and helping foster for those rescues and shetlers. What we are saying is we should do everything possible to stop the abuse of animals, the overpopulation of animals and the breedng and selling of all animals. There's no reason why informing people that they shouldn't buy from pet stores shouldn't be part of the laundry list of other things we do.

No one here has said that that not buying form stores will solve all our problems, but buying from them certainly isn't either.

 

[wonderwhiskers]

I think you're assuming that all the members of this forum do is post here and tell people to not buy from petshops. There are many of us that are active in petitioning, writing letters to our local, state and national government, participating in protests, writing store owners, reporting abuse to different authorities, running education programs, volunteering at shelters, running rescues and helping foster for those rescues and shetlers. What we are saying is we should do everything possible to stop the abuse of animals, the overpopulation of animals and the breedng and selling of all animals. There's no reason why informing people that they shouldn't buy from pet stores shouldn't be part of the laundry list of other things we do.

No one here has said that that not buying form stores will solve all our problems, but buying from them certainly isn't either.

I did'nt assume that all you did was come here. Not at all. I have of course looked at the Cavy Spirit site, and looked at everything on that. I've read everything I can on this site, and I know that alot of members do alot.
Did you assume that all I do is come on here?
I'm part of a debate team, and we often go round local schools to tell small children about petshops. (They are of course close to the root of the problem).
I also volunteer on my only day off at the RSPCA shelter, and have fostered. I'm waiting to be given a new foster.
I fundraise. I blog. I did a huge project for my english GCSE on petshops, vegitarianism and animal rights. For my citezanship coursework I did something similar, but also raised money.
I'm part of an organsation which takes dogs to Nursing homes and hospitals as part of therapy, and have raised awareness that way.


Thats while I'm still at school studying. I will do as much as I can in the future .. but like I said before bit by bit.

When you have wonky teeth .. you dont just whack them into place with a hammer. It would'nt work. They would break.
You get braces and gradually let time work and push your teeth straight.
We should do the same for this problem.
Thats just my opinion, if you disagree, I respect that.
Time is a healer.

 

[Paula]

Paula, You are missing the point I'm trying to make.

You're mistaken, because I haven't missed it. I simply don't think it's valid.

 

[wonderwhiskers]

You're mistaken, because I haven't missed it. I simply don't think it's valid.

I simply said what you said to me.
I understand everything you said. I saw every point you made,but I think your being very narrow minded.
If you don't mind me saying, I also thought it was disrespectful to say 'your missing my point' and 'maybe some day you'll be misfortunate enough to see the true cruelties'. It was pretty hypocrytical, and to be honest a little rude, to just assume I had'nt already seen what I have seen.
Especially after telling me that you'd appreciate it if I did'nt 'make assumptions' just for saying 'before anyone bites my head off'.
Well, why is it fair you assume I am totally blissfully ignorant to the real horrors that come with having animals as pets?

 

[wonderwhiskers]

To be honest, I think you were more then a little rude then .. you were dismissive and narrow minded.
At the end of the day, we all want the same thing ..to stop petshops and for animals to be looked after the best way possible.

Whats wrong with the fact that I am open to more then one way of achieving this?
Surely if you really cared, you'd be trying to find as many possible way as you could, not only to close down pet shops, but to make life bearable for the poor creatures in them already?

Or is it the fact that I have some positive things to point out about petshops that bothers you?
You took what I said out of context ..and I think that once again is being narrow minded.
Have you even bothered to properly read it? Or are you just skimming through looking for things to critise?

I haven't said anything here to offend you. I have been open minded and polite about all your points and opinions. Is it that hard to be polite?

 

[PiggieMom]

Honestly I have read all of your posts very thoroughly three times now and I don't understand what your point is at all, wonderwhiskers. I don't mean to be rude when I say this but it doesn't help that your grammar and spelling is off and with your double posting it's difficult to follow what you're saying. Can you explain to me in a few concise sentences what your exact point is and what we're disagreeing about?

As far as people's rudeness in this sub-forum it says right at the top of the page:

"The discussions in this forum sometimes get heated; passions tend to run high. Please be respectful. What some people consider lively debate, you may consider rude. If your sensibilities are easily offended, you may want to avoid this forum.
If you can't stand the heat, stay out of the Kitchen!"

 

[wonderwhiskers]

Honestly I have read all of your posts very thoroughly three times now and I don't understand what your point is at all, wonderwhiskers. I don't mean to be rude when I say this but it doesn't help that your grammar and spelling is off and with your double posting it's difficult to follow what you're saying. Can you explain to me in a few concise sentences what your exact point is and what we're disagreeing about?

As far as people's rudeness in this sub-forum it says right at the top of the page:

"The discussions in this forum sometimes get heated; passions tend to run high. Please be respectful. What some people consider lively debate, you may consider rude. If your sensibilities are easily offended, you may want to avoid this forum.
If you can't stand the heat, stay out of the Kitchen!"

It hasn't offended me, I'm just pointing out the facts. She was rude.
And being a Mod, being rude does'nt exactly set a good precedent does it?
As for spelling and grammer ..I don't have a spell check, it is 23:56, and I am rushing this and am also writing a reference, so I apologise for the grammer and spelling of my posts, but not the content.

I think I have explained myself fully. If you'd like me to answer a precise question, then fair enough but you cannot expect me to shorten my beliefs to a few sentences.

 

[wonderwhiskers]

Like said in the little thing at the top, 'Be respectful'.
Being dismissive and narrow minded, patronising and hypocritical is not respectful in my books. But maybe that's just how I was bought up?

 

[PiggieMom]

Well, I disagree. I don't fine Paula to be rude at all.

My question is what exactly are you trying to say about pet stores?

The people of this forum are anti-breeding, anti-showing and anti-pet store. We don't believe in shopping in any store that sells live animals at all. This means no buying an animal, no buying supplies. The reason this is is because when money goes to the pet store it goes to breeders. Even stores that take in "rescues" to sell still support the idea that selling live animals is acceptable. So any pet store that sells live animals, no matter how well they treat the animals, is one we would not shop at. Period. We hope that by giving the pet stores less money, less animals will be purchased from breeders and therefore less breeding will happen. This method of boycotting has proven to work in the past with cats and dogs.

We also report abusive and neglectful persons. Many of us also work to educate store owners and breeders and supporters of pet stores in hopes they will change their ways. We educate in proper care to everyone, regardless of their beliefs. Yes, it is preferable that pet store owners are not abusive to their animals, but that does not mean we support them or purchase anything from them and we try our best to convince others to not purchase anything from them.

So what, exactly, about that do you disagree with?

(Also, try using Firefox. It's free to download and comes with a spell check. You can also control the use of your ellipses [those little dots...] and your double posting without the use of a spell check. It'd make your posts so much easier to read.)

 

[Paula]

I'm just gonna say that disagreeing with what you're saying and the point you're wanting to make doesn't mean I've been dismissive, narrow minded, patronizing, hypocritical or rude.

You can't just categorically dismiss someone who doesn't agree with you as any of those things. As to your statement that I'd "assumed" you were unaware of the real goings on of pet stores - that wasn't an assumption, because you yourself said you'd never been to the back room at Pets at Home, the pet store you think so highly of. Seeing animals turned in by owners who grew tired of them is not the same as seeing the conditions the animals are living in at the store. That you've developed a relationship with the staff at one pet store and feel they are "better" than others doesn't change the fact that pet stores selling animals is fundamentally wrong on a number of levels. And that includes the store you've grown to love so much.

I don't disagree that it would be nice to improve the conditions of animals living in pet stores and being sold as merchandise. I think it would be better still if they weren't sold at all.

And yes, you did explain yourself fully, again and again. I read it all and I still don't agree with you. If that makes me rude or dismissive in your mind, then so be it.