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Thread: Breeding and showing

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    Cavy Slave
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    Breeding and showing

    Where did you get your Guinea Pigs from? Seriously without breeders nice healthy piggies would not be available. And cavy shows. I mean I would'nt know about the 13 different breeds and I probably wouldn't be a cavy enthuisiast if it weren't shows.

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    Cavy Slave DocDolittle's Avatar
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    Re: Breeding and showing

    I got my first boy from a pet store( bad choice) and I rescued my second. I don't have much time, but most breeders are being completely irresponsible and just breeding for money, not health. And shows? Maybe you'd learn more if you volunteered at a pig rescue instead of promoting bad breeders. You should obviously research much better.

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    Cavy Slave
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    Re: Breeding and showing

    http://www.cavyspirit.com/breeding.htm

    Read that! PLus read this thread:http://cavycages.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9518

    All of this has been disscused very extensivly. Please read these threads, and you will see people's veiws.

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    Cavy Slave
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    Re: Breeding and showing

    Well in the area I live (black hills south dakota) there are no pig rescues I have looked
    If there was I would check it out
    Also what if everybody stopped breeding what would happen then huh

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    Cavy Slave
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    Re: Breeding and showing

    I got mine from high kill shelters. They were deliberately bred and then dumped. Most of them were healthy.

    There are millions of animals killed in shelters every year and many more abandoned. There is a huge pet overpopulation. Your lame argument holds no water. There will always be too many without deliberate breeding.

    Where did you look? I bet there are many homeless ones near you.

    Maybe you should read this page:

    http://www.cavyspirit.com/breeding.htm and http://cavyspirit.com/responsiblebreeder.htm
    Last edited by rabbitsncavyluv; 09-19-05 at 09:35 pm.

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    Cavy Slave
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    Re: Breeding and showing

    This shelter has guinea pigs:

    Humane Society of The Black Hills
    Rapid City, South Dakota, SD
    605 394-4170
    [email protected]

    There are more rescources here: http://www.guinealynx.info/rescues.html and www.cavyrescue.com

    This shelter in Sioux Falls has them too: http://www.sfhumanesociety.com/
    Last edited by rabbitsncavyluv; 09-19-05 at 09:37 pm.

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    Cavy Star Susan9608's Avatar
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    Re: Breeding and showing

    What would happen if everyone stopped breeding? Gosh ... if *everyone* - breeders and backyard breeders alike - quit breeding, first the same people who were intending to purchase a guinea pig from a pet store would do so. But then, there wouldn't be 2 or 3 guinea pigs waiting to take that pig's place. So the pet stores would eventually be out of guinea pigs.

    Then people who wanted guinea pigs would be forced to turn to shelters, rescue organizations and individuals looking to rehome their pets. A lot of people would take guinea pigs from these places.

    And some people will still get tired of having their guinea pigs or will be unable - for whatever reason - to care for them, so the pigs will end up back in the shelters. This will happen for a while.

    But eventually, probably many, many YEARS after the breeding stops, a guinea pig in a rescue will be a rare occurence.

    At that point, responsible animal enthusiasts and guinea pig gurus would probably get together to *discuss* a responsible program to ensure the survival of the guinea pig ... and this progam would cover all aspects of guinea pig care, including a mandatory spay or neuter program for the adopted guinea pigs.

    Guinea pigs would never again be sold as merchandise in pet stores; they would be adopted out only. New owers would be carefully questioned and screened to ensure that proper care would be given to the guinea pig. And a guinea pig would never again suffer at the hands of an uneducated, uncommitted owner.

    Sounds great, doesn't it?

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    Cavy Slave
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    Re: Breeding and showing

    I am not so sure I agree with mandatory spay and neuter, especially the spay for females, afterall, it is a fairly risky procedure, a lot of females could end up not making it. Ultimately in the end, I think good public education is the best answer.



    At that point, responsible animal enthusiasts and guinea pig gurus would probably get together to *discuss* a responsible program to ensure the survival of the guinea pig ... and this progam would cover all aspects of guinea pig care, including a mandatory spay or neuter program for the adopted guinea pigs.

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    Cavy Slave
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    Re: Breeding and showing

    What you neglect to mention is that you will never get a good, healthy pig from a breeder, as he keeps those pigs for himself to re-breed. The only pigs they sell or give away are the ones that they cannot use for their own nefarious ends.

    Plus I do not think we ever have been or that we ever will be in danger of driving breeders to extinction. Just as good is an inseperable part of humanity, so is evil, and criminals who practice it. Be them common street thugs, drug dealers, dishonest politicians, dictators or warlords, small animal breeders, terrorists, ..., evil in its many forms has and will continue to always be with us. Why is a topic of debate among many intellectuals, but that evil has been a part of any human society from the dawn of time; no one can debate that.

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    Cavy Star Susan9608's Avatar
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    Re: Breeding and showing

    Oh please ... you pick one part of my statement - regarding the spaying of guinea pigs - and totally ignore everything else I said. Good public education? Gimme a break. Education is a wonderful thing, but there are some people so stubborn and so convinced that everything is different for *them* that they will not follow what they KNOW is right.

    For instance, read through all the posts on this forum about people who KNOW it's bad and wrong to buy guinea pigs from pet stores but do it anyway. These people have been educated time and time again on the problems with purchasing guinea pigs from pet stores; they will even state that they know it's wrong. But they do it anyway. For whatever reason, they tell themselves that it's okay that they did it this one time.

    So is the case with people who want to breed their guinea pigs. They think it's okay because they are the only people who will truly be responsible. Their children *need* to see the miracle of birth. They think it will be fun to have "just one" litter of guinea pig babies, then they'll quit mating their pigs.

    You can't totally rely on education and count on the individual to take it to heart. There have to be checks and balances in the system to prevent that one person from thinking that it's okay for him to do it, but not anyone else. Therefore, some kind of spaying/neutering program is necessary ... whether that's simply neutering every male guinea pig in existence or both spaying the females and neutering the males, to ensure that no one slips through the cracks.

    And, as Acess said, we will never be in danger of driving the breed to extinction anyways ... what is needed is control - population control.

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    Cavy Slave
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    Re: Breeding and showing

    Quote Originally Posted by Susan9608
    Oh please ... you pick one part of my statement - regarding the spaying of guinea pigs - and totally ignore everything else I said. Sorry, I really did not mean to offend... I thought most of your ideas where rather lovely, I should have indicated so I suppose, I just got sidetracked in my mind about the spaying issue... it won't happen again.

    Good public education? Gimme a break. Education is a wonderful thing, but there are some people so stubborn and so convinced that everything is different for *them* that they will not follow what they KNOW is right. I know exactly what you mean about these people who seem almost hell bent on doing the wrong thing, convinced they have a good enough excuse for it. However.... Education WORKS. And the internet is a powerful tool. It may take years to effect change, however over time it can and is happening. I came to Cavy Spirit looking for advice on breeding, because I was thinking about getting a Guinea Pig. I was spending a lot of time in pet stores looking at them. But, with what I read in about 10 minutes on Cavy Spirit showed me just how wrong breeding was, and exactly why not to get my pig from a pet store. I drove almost an hour, (acutally my husband did because I cannot drive) and it took a lot of heated discussions with him to convince him to go that far to rescue our piggy. We spent at least twice as much on gas as we would have just to buy a pig at a pet store. This weekend I have arranged with my husband to go another hour out of our way in the other direction to find a friend for our Bootie. I have a friend who got piggies from the pet store, she had no idea they where even available at rescues or shelters. She thought that was just for cats and dogs. Yes, we will always have butt heads who don't care, and no matter how many times they are told, they will come up with their own reasons, and rationalise their actions, and support the stores, but a good many people will listen. History has proven this with many other causes.

    For instance, read through all the posts on this forum about people who KNOW it's bad and wrong to buy guinea pigs from pet stores but do it anyway. These people have been educated time and time again on the problems with purchasing guinea pigs from pet stores; they will even state that they know it's wrong. But they do it anyway. For whatever reason, they tell themselves that it's okay that they did it this one time.

    So is the case with people who want to breed their guinea pigs. They think it's okay because they are the only people who will truly be responsible. Their children *need* to see the miracle of birth. They think it will be fun to have "just one" litter of guinea pig babies, then they'll quit mating their pigs.

    You can't totally rely on education and count on the individual to take it to heart. There have to be checks and balances in the system to prevent that one person from thinking that it's okay for him to do it, but not anyone else. Therefore, some kind of spaying/neutering program is necessary ... whether that's simply neutering every male guinea pig in existence or both spaying the females and neutering the males, to ensure that no one slips through the cracks. Again though, and I am admittely not very educated on the whole spay / neuter process for piggies, but what is the mortality rate for spaying females? I know it can be risky even for cats and dogs depending on the vet and vet experiance. I have had 2 friends that lost cats that way. However, my cat is spayed. I had a cat several years ago that bonded to my sister in the end, so when she moved away I let her take the cat, and we had the cat declawed and spayed. We where first time cat owners, and the vet told us the procedure was fine. Afterwards, I found out more information about it and decided never to declaw again, no matter what. My next cat was only spayed. I suppose with cat populations it is looked at in that if you loose 1 cat out of every X amount, it is worth it to stop overpopulation, however what is this rate for G.P's? I have a feeling it is pretty high... But I could be wrong.


    As for putting breeding operations in the hands of those that truely care for the breed, would it not be sad if it was the breeders we are fighting right now? We have a hard enough time in our world keeping kids safe and out of harms way, I don't see any legislative body spending any kind of significant resources to check out the breeders qualifications. Infact, the whole show industry to the untrained eye would probably look like the perfect governing body for this...

    I don't want to fight. That was not my intention. I just wondered about the spaying mortality rates, and if it really is in the best interests of the pigs, considering most people are responsible with education and WOULD NOT breed them. Perhaps you disagree, that is your entitlement.

    And, as Acess said, we will never be in danger of driving the breed to extinction anyways ... what is needed is control - population control.

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    Cavy Slave Sabriel's Avatar
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    Re: Breeding and showing

    I think spaying would be less risky with a young sow then it is with an older sow. Usually older sows are spayed due to tumors and reproductive problems. There is usually something else going on in there.

    The more sows get spayed the better the vets get at it. It is like that with all animals.

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    Cavy Star Susan9608's Avatar
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    Re: Breeding and showing

    Thecalders -

    I acknowledge that yes, it is risky to spay a female guinea pig. Is that what you are wanting? I know that it's risky. I also know that it's not a simple procedure to neuter a guinea pig, if it's not done by a competent and experienced vet.

    I am *not* endorsing spaying all the guinea pigs currently in existence ... which you can plainly see if you read my post carefully enough. Someone asked what would happen if *everyone* stopped breeding. My speculation as to what would happen is that a) some people would still buy pet store pigs, but eventually pet stores would sell out and be unable to replace their "merchandise;" 2) people would then have to turn to shelters/rescues to obtain pet guinea pigs; C) there would be some returning of guinea pigs to the shelters and rehoming through newspaper ads, etc, but eventually even shelters/rescues would rarely have guinea pigs for adoption; 4) Eventually, years after ALL breeding had stopped, some responsible guinea pig gurus would get together to discuss re-initiating a breeding program that would entail only a few licensed breeders, careful screening of all prospective adoptive "parents", and the prevention of backyard breeding.

    So how do you prevent backyard breeding? Yes, education is a wonderful tool and there are many, many people who will respond to it and learn from it. But you have to prepare for those people who won't pay attention, who won't feel it applies to them, and who think that everything will be different for them. Thus, spaying and neutering.

    If everyone stopped breeding, it would be a long, long time before more breeding would be necessary. In that time, more advanced and less risky techniques could be developed.

    But it's really a nit-picky little point you're dwelling on. You're turning the whole scope of what I said into this one little issue .... and if that's your focus, then that's fine. But you're glossing over everything else I've said to take issue with one, small detail.

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    Cavy Slave
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    Re: Breeding and showing

    thankyou I have found some nice boys http://www.petfinder.org/pet.cgi?act...w=0&tmpl=&stat at the humane society

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    Cavy Slave
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    Re: Breeding and showing

    They look a little shy , but VERY handsome!

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    Cavy Slave Sabriel's Avatar
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    Re: Breeding and showing

    Maybe they are just camera shy. Good for you for giving thses two boys another chance!

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    Cavy Slave
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    Thumbs up Re: Breeding and showing

    They look really sweet Bobo I am sure they will make wonderful friends.

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