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Thread: Wanted: Acctual and reasonable solutions to the "pet store problems"

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    Cavy Slave Highhopes112's Avatar
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    Wanted: Acctual and reasonable solutions to the "pet store problems"

    All over the internet there are long winded animal ranting and raving about pet store problems: the piggies are kept in tiny aquariums, they come from insufficient breeders, they end up ill and pregnant and on and on and on.. THEY ARE NOT WRONG, however all they do is go on and on about how no one should ever buy from a pet store and if you do you are the devil and frankly its just becoming white noise that and nothing is ever going to change. Earlier on this website I was reading another topic about pet stores and one user said that they wouldn't buy from a pet store that sold cats and dogs and suggested that instead of selling these animals they hold adoption fairs which is a very good idea, and it got me thinking... instead of just ranting on the internet like pompous nut jobs why not actually think about it an try to come up with realistic, reasonable, and actionable solutions to the problem. Yes, I know it's just brainstorming on the internet but we have to start somewhere. Things like "all pet stores should have football arena size habitats for their guinea pigs where they run around in the sunshine with unicorns and rainbows every day of the year" are obviously NOT going to work, they have to be financially reasonable, and practical or we are just wasting time. I mean there are obvious ones like "employees need more training" and what not, but we should at least get the conversation moving in a positive, productive direction...

    There may be other threads with this same topic, idk I didn't look that hard but frankly if there were even a third as many as there are bashing pet stores we would be in a much better place.

    I don't care what you think is a problem with pet stores, I don't care if it's guinea pig specific or about another kind of animal, or maybe you think the uniforms are ugly, I don't care, whatever it is come up with a solution and post it here.
    (It's not just "guinea pig people" who do the ranting and raving but I don't really read forums about anything else so...)

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    Administrator bpatters's Avatar
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    Re: Wanted: Acctual and reasonable solutions to the "pet store problems"

    Note to people who respond to this. This thread MUST stay on the topic of what can be done about pet stores. It is NOT a thread to discuss whether or not pet store sales are appropriate, or the conditions that pet store pigs are bred and raised in. Any response that can't stay on topic will be deleted.

  3. "Thank you, bpatters, for this useful post," say these 2 members:


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    Administrator bpatters's Avatar
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    Re: Wanted: Acctual and reasonable solutions to the "pet store problems"

    It would be great to come up with some ideas, but I can tell you that it's incredibly difficult to effect any change in the status quo. If I remember correctly, California has a new law prohibiting the sale of dogs, cats, and rabbits, but it excludes guinea pigs. One of the northeastern states does have a law prohibiting the sale of any live animal other than fish.

    But the pet store lobby is VERY strong, and efforts have been made before to enact laws prohibiting the sale of live animals. Teresa Murphy, who owns this site, has been involved in this effort before, and has thrown considerable weight, including money, into efforts to enact such laws.

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    Cavy Slave Highhopes112's Avatar
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    Re: Wanted: Acctual and reasonable solutions to the "pet store problems"

    I agree that effecting change is very hard but we have to start somewhere and I feel like all anyone is doing is ranting and complaining. Do I think that this one thread is going to fix the problem, absolutely not, but I feel like all anyone is doing is saying what they are doing wrong and honestly I think that's only making things worse. When all you do is tell people that they are doing something wrong they stop listening and you become marginalized if people are as passionate about this as they claim to be why not try coming up with solutions rather then just condemning pet stores? That hasn't helped thus far. I think it's time to try something else.
    "The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result."

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    Cavy Slave CrystalCavy's Avatar
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    Re: Wanted: Acctual and reasonable solutions to the "pet store problems"

    First of all, applause to you Highhopes112. I haven't seen many people on forums who do step forward and try to find real and reasonable solutions to the pet store problem. Like bpatters, I think it's a great idea and I'll try to help however I can.

    Toronto has a law banning the sale of dogs and cats but any other pet is allowed I'm pretty sure.

    Anyways, some ideas I have for solutions are:

    1) A higher cost for buying animals and lower cost for adoptions to get people to turn to adopting. Although I'm not 100% sure how you would achieve this. Maybe taxes or extra fees for buying or something? Sorry, I'm not an adult so I am not super familiar with taxes and extra fees. Someone else can add details.

    2) By just doing normal awareness stuff and getting the public to know what happens behind the scenes in pet stores. Some people don't care but others just genuinely DON'T KNOW about the pet store problem. Some people think it's silly but it does work! Plus, when it comes to making new laws, the more people who support it, the better.

    3) Uh, I'm running out of ideas. I'll keep thinking though!

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    Cavy Caged
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    Re: Wanted: Acctual and reasonable solutions to the "pet store problems"

    This is an amazing idea for change in the Pet Store Environment.

    1) - You could always start a Petition in your local area and send it too the local city council

    2) - If You want something major you could always file for a Referendum (If Your State Allows and You are of age) this is when people vote on a Legislative Issues on the next state ballot.

    Note - These processes are very lengthy and could take years ALMOST a decade to vote on I hope these ideas are very helpful and Good Luck

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    Cavy Slave Highhopes112's Avatar
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    Re: Wanted: Acctual and reasonable solutions to the "pet store problems"

    The last time I was in a pet store I of course had to stop and look at the sleeping ferrets and noticed that they were (for some reason, I know nothing about ferrets) in a different type of cage it was more like a free standing wire mesh sort of group cage and I wondered why the guinea pigs couldn't be in something more like that, I feel like it would be more breathable and it could be divided up in like pie slice sections to keep them separate from one another. Or even if they were in metal cages rather then glass aquariums. I mean why do they have to be behind glass? I know it won't give them more space but at least it would be a start you know.

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    Cavy Caged
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    Re: Wanted: Acctual and reasonable solutions to the "pet store problems"

    Quote Originally Posted by Highhopes112 View Post
    The last time I was in a pet store I of course had to stop and look at the sleeping ferrets and noticed that they were (for some reason, I know nothing about ferrets) in a different type of cage it was more like a free standing wire mesh sort of group cage and I wondered why the guinea pigs couldn't be in something more like that, I feel like it would be more breathable and it could be divided up in like pie slice sections to keep them separate from one another. Or even if they were in metal cages rather then glass aquariums. I mean why do they have to be behind glass? I know it won't give them more space but at least it would be a start you know.
    At My Local Petsmart they used to have only 1 guinea pig at a time in a custom made cage. Since they got a new manager they tossed the new cage and now have glass aquariums. I guess the aquariums are used so you can see the Guinea Pigs like fish or more visible maybe it's a marketing thing
    Last edited by Guinea2002; 09-18-17 at 06:20 pm.

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    Cavy Star, Photo Contest Winner ThePigAlchemist's Avatar
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    Re: Wanted: Acctual and reasonable solutions to the "pet store problems"

    Honestly? The best solution I can think of is to stop selling live animals in pet stores entirely. I don't know if that counts as an actual and reasonable solution, but I feel that even if the animals were sourced responsibly and well taken care of, having them in the store encourages impulse buys, and usually an impulse bought animal isn't going to a good home. Since pet stores are about making money and the pets bring people to the stores, they're not going to stop without either laws requiring them to not sell animals or intense public pressure, but I think that is the ideal to work towards.

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    Cavy Slave ryliem's Avatar
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    Re: Wanted: Acctual and reasonable solutions to the "pet store problems"

    Maybe if they raised the price of animals at pet stores then they can use the extra funds to get bigger habitats and train their employees. It also helps the animals not go to a bad home because someone with bad intentions isn't going to pay $70 for a guinea pig.

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    Cavy Slave
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    Re: Wanted: Acctual and reasonable solutions to the "pet store problems"

    Unfortunately they make too much money off treating the animals badly and selling them cheaply to anyone who asks. Some pet stores do have policies that allow employees to refuse sales if the customer's not equipped for the pet, but that requires the employee to know and care about the species' needs, and I'd estimate maybe half of them actually make any effort.

    With the economy structured the way it does, corporations like petco and petsmart value profit over people and over pets. The only way they'll stop selling live animals was if it was no longer profitable for them to do so.

    I suppose that's a long-winded way of saying the best way to shut them down is, actually, by spreading the word and complaining. The less people buy animals from them, the fewer live animals they stock.


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    Cavy Slave Highhopes112's Avatar
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    Re: Wanted: Acctual and reasonable solutions to the "pet store problems"

    I feel like part of the problem is the complaining. Its like I said, people just go on and on. Perhaps we need some kind of organized way of publicly distributing information verified by evidence and actual examples rather people saying that this happens and this happens. There should be a way of actually SHOWING people what is going on rather then just saying "if you don't believe me look it up"

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    Cavy Caged
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    Re: Wanted: Acctual and reasonable solutions to the "pet store problems"

    [QUOTE=Highhopes112;994683]I feel like part of the problem is the complaining. Its like I said, people just go on and on. Perhaps we need some kind of organized way of publicly distributing information verified by evidence and actual examples rather people saying that this happens and this happens. There should be a way of actually SHOWING people what is going on rather then just saying "if you don't believe me look it up"[/QUOTE

    Yes that would be a Good Solution or actually make people research Guinea Pig Information before getting it from the Store. You could always start some type of campaign or something. You usually see LOADS of videos of people getting Pet Store pigs saying oh well I did my research. When I went to Petsmart for an Emergency Water Bottle they were like "Maybe some Vitamin Water, Or a New Kaytee Cage or no Guinea Pig can resist Yogurt Treats" Uneducated owners like these usually fall in because they think it's best for their pigs just because they don't do proper research. Maybe a good book could do a trick or a news story

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    Cavy Slave Highhopes112's Avatar
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    Re: Wanted: Acctual and reasonable solutions to the "pet store problems"

    I think that a good idea would be to do like a Guinea Pig adoption/rehoming fair were people can go to look, play and not just adopt them but learn from people who have them and are really into them about how to care for them and what's good for them and what isn't. You could sell C&C cages and/or materials, starter kits, books, etc. You could also educate people on "pet store problems".

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    Cavy Caged
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    Re: Wanted: Acctual and reasonable solutions to the "pet store problems"

    Quote Originally Posted by Highhopes112 View Post
    I think that a good idea would be to do like a Guinea Pig adoption/rehoming fair were people can go to look, play and not just adopt them but learn from people who have them and are really into them about how to care for them and what's good for them and what isn't. You could sell C&C cages and/or materials, starter kits, books, etc. You could also educate people on "pet store problems".
    That actually sounds like a Good Idea all we would need is a Loud of Money

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    Cavy Slave
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    Re: Wanted: Acctual and reasonable solutions to the "pet store problems"

    I don't think stopping the sale of animals in pet stores is a good idea. Think about the consequences, these pet stores run on the sale of these animals, without them they would close down, and it would be harder and more expensive to find basic care supplies and foods. Not every pet store buys their animals from horrible backyard/mill breeders, not being able to sell animals to pet stores will also send a lot of big breeders out of places to sell and out of business.

    Edited by bpatters

    I think the best solution is to enforce laws on mill breeders, some states/countries have them, but the majority doesn't enforce them right.
    Last edited by bpatters; 09-19-17 at 12:14 pm.

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    Administrator bpatters's Avatar
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    Re: Wanted: Acctual and reasonable solutions to the "pet store problems"

    Actually @Zofia, animals are a "loss leader" for pet stores. It costs more to ship/feed/house them than they bring in in money. But when someone makes an impulse buy of a pet in a store, they also buy bedding/food/cage/toys/equipment/etc. That's where the stores make their money.

    It's like milk in the grocery store -- the stores don't usually make any money on milk. But nearly everybody wants milk, so the stores put the milk in the very back of the store where you have to walk past other items on the way to pick it up. When you buy those items, or the other items you also needed, that's where they get their money.

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    Cavy Slave
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    Re: Wanted: Acctual and reasonable solutions to the "pet store problems"

    Quote Originally Posted by bpatters View Post
    Actually @Zofia, animals are a "loss leader" for pet stores. It costs more to ship/feed/house them than they bring in in money. But when someone makes an impulse buy of a pet in a store, they also buy bedding/food/cage/toys/equipment/etc. That's where the stores make their money.

    It's like milk in the grocery store -- the stores don't usually make any money on milk. But nearly everybody wants milk, so the stores put the milk in the very back of the store where you have to walk past other items on the way to pick it up. When you buy those items, or the other items you also needed, that's where they get their money.
    Still adds to my point. If no one is buying the animals, they won't be buying anything else, putting them out of business and making it harder to find those supplies/foods. I'm thinking long term, most people seem to be thinking short term.

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    Administrator bpatters's Avatar
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    Re: Wanted: Acctual and reasonable solutions to the "pet store problems"

    Well, not really. They still sell a ton of dog and cat food and supplies, but they don't sell dogs and cats in most states. They make far more money and dogs and cats than on exotic pets.

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    Cavy Caged
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    Re: Wanted: Acctual and reasonable solutions to the "pet store problems"

    I understand what you mean about these Long Term affects many "Good" Brands are found at pet stores supposedly and many brands and companies could collapse. It's kind of hard explaning due too anything can happen. Most stores besides pet stores and online don't sell much stuff.

    Let say For Example the US passes a law and Bans All Sales of Animals there might be a Little or no Problem because not everyone buys Online. So the Pet Store Industry might not fail completely.

    Another Example could be that Online Sellers take over in near future. Amazon has been blamed for killing or in the process of Department Stores like Sears, Jcpenney and other major lines.

    In my thinking I Think if animals are banned the Pet Industry may be hit but not enough to sink it

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