Aggression Will they ever get along?

[ryliem]

I recently introduced my two boars and they seem to be getting along in the nutral space. I put them together in a cage (also free of smell) and it seemed like introductions started all over again. I put them in the cage at the same time and everything so they wouldnt be "meeting" again.

I watched them as the process started all over again, but this time it didnt seem to end. I put a divider between them for the night but one of them managed to get over it just so he could bully the other.

I kept trying different ways to seperate them until I couldnt take it anymore. One of the pigs couldnt come out of the house because the other one would chace him back in.

They are in separate cages across the room from eachother now. Is it possible they will never get along? Can I do introductions again?

 

[onefutui2e]

I'm sure others will give more advice on how to introduce them. I think a red flag in your situation is that you put a house down. You shouldn't put any enclosed furniture down because it allows the exact scenario you described; the dominant pig will just corner the other one.

A year ago I tried and failed to introduce two boars; they kept hurting each other and they basically spent all night chasing each other and chattering. So I gave them their own separate cages with a wall separating them (I reinforced it with ties and tape so that they wouldn't get through). I think they still both benefited from each other's presence at the end of it. The one I had started being more active, putting on weight, and generally seemed happier; I adopted the second one after so I have no idea what his life was like beforehand. They're a lot better now, maybe because they've spent over a year next to each other interacting through the bars in the wall. I let them have limited floor time together now and they seem to enjoy it, even though they become contentious. I'm hoping that once I move into my new apartment I can get them to be roommates again.

 

[CavyTV]

The problem is that you separated them when you shouldn't have. It's normal for guinea pigs to "start over" again in their cage because it's a new area. Even if it has no piggie smells they will do the same dominance behaviors in the cage as they did during introductions. Dominance behaviors differ from pair to pair; some do it all the time for the rest of their lives, some only do it in the beginning and less when they get older and more mature, others rarely do it because they are laid back. It does not matter how they are, guinea pigs will be guinea pigs and they will display those behaviors in order to communicate. They are trying to decide who will be the boss pig and you separating them is making the process slower. Every time you separate them, they will want to get to each other and they will have to start the process all over again. Their behaviors shouldn't annoy you, they're fine and they're doing everything that's normal. If you can't "take it anymore" and you have little patience then you should consider giving them to someone else.

You need to do introductions again. Do it exactly how you did it before. When you're satisfied they will be okay in the cage (meaning no blood will be drawn), you can put them in. Leave them be. Let them work it out. You can include hideys, just make sure they have 2 doors not 1. This will prevent them from trapping each other. Only separate if blood is drawn. If there's no blood let them be together. I know it may seem scary at first but trust me, it's way less stressful and complicated for your guinea pigs than it is for you. They know what they're doing. If one pig is not able to eat, then you can separate. If they are just chasing and cornering each other that's fine. As long as there is no blood drawn and both pigs get enough to eat and drink they can live together.

 

[ryliem]

The problem is that you separated them when you shouldn't have. It's normal for guinea pigs to "start over" again in their cage because it's a new area. Even if it has no piggie smells they will do the same dominance behaviors in the cage as they did during introductions. Dominance behaviors differ from pair to pair; some do it all the time for the rest of their lives, some only do it in the beginning and less when they get older and more mature, others rarely do it because they are laid back. It does not matter how they are, guinea pigs will be guinea pigs and they will display those behaviors in order to communicate. They are trying to decide who will be the boss pig and you separating them is making the process slower. Every time you separate them, they will want to get to each other and they will have to start the process all over again. Their behaviors shouldn't annoy you, they're fine and they're doing everything that's normal. If you can't "take it anymore" and you have little patience then you should consider giving them to someone else.

You need to do introductions again. Do it exactly how you did it before. When you're satisfied they will be okay in the cage (meaning no blood will be drawn), you can put them in. Leave them be. Let them work it out. You can include hideys, just make sure they have 2 doors not 1. This will prevent them from trapping each other. Only separate if blood is drawn. If there's no blood let them be together. I know it may seem scary at first but trust me, it's way less stressful and complicated for your guinea pigs than it is for you. They know what they're doing. If one pig is not able to eat, then you can separate. If they are just chasing and cornering each other that's fine. As long as there is no blood drawn and both pigs get enough to eat and drink they can live together.

I seperated them because it was getting close to blood being drawn. They were just flying at each other and fighting. When I said "I couldn't take it anymore" I meant watching one of my pigs corner the other one and continuously attack him. I am fully capable of caring for them.

They were non stop fighting for almost two days, even when I put a grid between them. The bully was climbing over it just to attack the other one. If separating them is going to make is slower, than fine. I won't put them together at all,but I am not going to stand by and watch them tear eachother apart. I have enough grids to house four guinea pigs, I can always get them fixed and buy females.

 

[lissie]

How big is the current cage? How many hideys are there in the cage? Only use hideys with multiple doors, so one cannot trap another inside. I like fleece forest, they can run through them and use them as hideys.

See this page for boars behaviors​ and how to help them get along.

https://www.guinealynx.info/forums/viewtopic.php?t=46468

 

[ryliem]

2×5 grids and I have 2 hideys. Thanks for the fleece forrest and the link

 

[onefutui2e]

To clarify, I separated mine only because they were more or less taking turns drawing blood against each other over the course of a week. I've been told *some* blood may inevitably be drawn due to the nature of their behavior, but it became a regular enough occurrence that it just didn't work out.

If you have enough space and resources to house them separately for now, I would put their cages next to each other so they can see and interact through the grids. Mine each have their own Midwest cage side-by-side, but I occasionally leave them with my girlfriend who has a 2x4 grid C&C cage, leaving them only 2x2 each. Their interactions in the C&C are much more interesting and lively since there's much more proximity and exposure.

 

[CavyMama]

Do the hideys have multiple openings? With only one opening, a pig can be trapped into or kept out of a hidey which won't help in getting them to a place where they co-exist peacefully.

 

[CavyTV]

I seperated them because it was getting close to blood being drawn. They were just flying at each other and fighting. When I said "I couldn't take it anymore" I meant watching one of my pigs corner the other one and continuously attack him. I am fully capable of caring for them.

They were non stop fighting for almost two days, even when I put a grid between them. The bully was climbing over it just to attack the other one. If separating them is going to make is slower, than fine. I won't put them together at all,but I am not going to stand by and watch them tear eachother apart. I have enough grids to house four guinea pigs, I can always get them fixed and buy females.

What do you mean by "attacking"? Just cornering? What did he do when he cornered the other one? Separating and putting them back together (intentional or not) over and over again is also stressful. If it's easier to just get 2 more guinea pigs, do so.

During introductions and re-introductions, my Flyn lunged at Bramley several times. They pulled hair, nipped, shoved, cornered, chased...but now they get along just fine. Maybe if you gave them more time they will calm down and eventually learn to tolerate each other. From what I've read, it seems like it's only been a short time since they've been introduced.

 

[ryliem]

Yeah, im going to try one more time. I havnt intorduced them since all this happend. I orderd more grids so I can seperate them, but they can still interact if all else fails,

 

[Jeff williams]

I have 2 young boars that I have in a 16 sq ft open cage they seem to be bonding for now they sometimes stay sperated one will be in one hideaway on one side of cage and the other on the other side or one will go inside a fleece pocket I have in the cage ...my wife separated them at first to see what they would do and they would scream for each other until wee put them back together and when I take one out the other will chirp for him so I'm guessing they are bounding and I'm hoping they stay that way if not I have enough room to divide them if needed....

 

[CavyTV]

You shouldn't experiment with them like that. You're causing stress. Only separate if one cannot eat and is losing weight or if blood is drawn, not to just "see what they would do".

 

[onefutui2e]

If it helps, put them in a separate room; that way, you're not compelled to interfere every time they try to posture at each other. It is incredibly stressful to watch this happen in real-time and your presence may actually stunt the process itself because every time they do their thing, your impulse is to watch them, which they may notice and back off. But check on them daily (maybe even twice) to make sure there aren't any wounds and that they aren't losing any weight, etc.

From what you're telling us, it doesn't seem like it's THAT bad. Maybe get a bigger cage, but you should let them work it out themselves. My situation was a bit more extreme because I had two in-their-prime boars in a 2x4 cage and they were constantly hurting each other. I'm in the process of building a custom 4x4 cage.

 

[Jeff williams]

Yes I was experimenting whatever they where in the same cage with a small wall up they still could see and smell each other and I had to see what would happen any way as if they for some reason stop getting along id have to separate them anyway so maybe ask question instead of assuming I'm doing it to be mean...

 

[CavyTV]

The way to see if they can get along is to leave them alone and let them work it out. How is separating them first thing gonna help you decide if they can live together? They should be properly introduced and left alone so they can establish who will be the boss pig.

 

[Jeff williams]

Why don't you worry about your guinea pigs I'll worry about mine how does that sound

 

[CavyTV]

No need to feel offended. I am simply trying to understand what you mean and offering advice on what to do and what not to do. That's all. I care about the life of all guinea pigs, not just mine.

 

[Jeff williams]

I was simply commenting on my personal experience and me separating them for 5 sec max is the same as me picking one up to exam and brush them while the other is in the cage waiting his turn so not a big deal in my opinion, but I'm not the expert nor will I ever claim to be

 

[Jeff williams]

Andwhats done is done they are fine now get along great they even call out to each other when I put in there veggies so the other knows there is something good over here
Plus they pretty much stay on opposite ends of the cage anyway so it's almost like they separate themselves anyway ..

 

[CavyTV]

Alright, well you did not say how long you separated them for. From what I've read it seemed like you separated them for a while which was why I said what I said. But it doesn't matter and we should just drop the subject. I'm glad they get along now.