Animal Welfare Adopt a pet and don't have funds for vet!

couchon said:

This was a typo. I believe in not making MEDICAL decisions for my animals based on finances.

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Still the same meaning. When you are at the point of needing a reverse mortgage, removing money from a retirement account or life insurance policy, then we're talking much more money than the cost of simple medical issues. And I would seriously question if these choices are in the best interest of both pet and owner.

Obviously there are a few of us who have varying views on personal finances but it is called personal finances for a reason. We each have to make our own decisions based on what we believe is best for our money, our families, our pets and our futures.

So far I am able to provide the vet care my pet may need. I was making good money and lost my job a year ago. I haven't been to a doc for general check up ever since. I took my gp today since I figured she came from a pet store and I just wanted to be sure all is well even though she looks great. I don't plan on seeing a doc unless something feels off. I do tend to put my pets first over myself, which many think I'm crazy, however I do draw the line on taking my pet in for an annual check if I'm in financial woes of unemployment to where keeping a roof over my head and food on the table is becoming a struggle and my pet looks fine. I do that for myself so it's not weird that I wouldn't do it for my pet. Now if I see something is off with her, then I will figure it out as I would for myself.

Pets are very good for folks who suffer severe depression. I am one of them. I live alone and have only 2 good friends because of this and my anxiety issues. Pets for the past 20 years have saved my life by making me feel loved and providing unconditional companionship and love. Anyone who suffers from chronic clinical depression and/or severe anxiety will be able to identify with this fact that having pet(s) saves your life (your emotional and mental well being) which if you don't have, then no point in going on with your physical empty life.

I also wonder about seeing a homeless man with his dog on the streets. The dogs always look healthy and good while the man doesn't. I see dog food and water there for the dog while the man struggles. There is no way I would take the dog away from this man. This is all he has left. In this situation I see a win/win situation for both as both lives are equally important.

couchon said:

Mamattorney, a car is not a living soul.

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A car may not be a living soul, but having a working vehicle can make a difference for all living souls in the house. If you cannot get to work because your car is broken, you could lose income for all souls in your house be they animal or human, and that would affect everyone's quality of life. Most people don't put a savings account in place when they purchase a car; but you can't deny that the cost to own a car includes the potential for repairs. Most people don't put aside their maximum out of pocket medical costs for themselves and their families, but you can't deny that that you could get into an accident or develop an illness today where your medical costs could go from $0 to $$$$$ overnight. I also agree with cavy_jdas about making not making blanket statements regarding medical decisions for pets. I, too, think it is absolutely reasonable to not put your family in long term financial jeopardy for a costly course of treatment/surgeries when there is little chance for survival for the animal or the post treatment quality of life would be questionable.

When I posted this I was not referring to those who might have a pet and then fall on hard times or even those that might have exhausted their vet fund and is trying to somehow deal with a huge bill. I know about those times as much as anyone. I was referring to those who bought or adopted an animal and never gave the vet care a second thought. Then brought it home to discover it is sick and has no way to take it to the vet. This is just irresponsible no matter how you look at it! If you didn't have a way to care for it properly then you shouldn't have adopted or bought it!

It's not about the OWNER - my whole belief, and I understand you disagree, is that the decision is to be made in the best interest of the animal ONLY, regardless of finances. And to whoever said they themselves would simply want to die quietly, maybe that's the difference too. I would want to keep on fighting and have someone fight for me until the bitter end.

What bothers me is separation between pets and family. I think pets ARE family. Would you not get medical treatment for a family member if it meant putting family finances in jeopardy?

couchon said:

What bothers me is separation between pets and family. I think pets ARE family. Would you not get medical treatment for a family member if it meant putting family finances in jeopardy?

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The difference here is insurance again. I know it doesn't cover everything, but plans generally cover way more than pet insurance does. The prices people pay are deducted, so most never get the sticker shock associated with actual medical care. And generally, people will hold other people higher than animals. It's natural as a species and then laws/legal issues reinforce it.

I consider my pets family, and will do whatever I can for them within reason. But I also know that I'd rather put an animal down then let it suffer because I can't afford the medical care without putting myself into further debt. I'm already looking at like $300k before interest from schooling alone. I will obviously do my best, but even in this profession, I know where my limits are. It's one of the things I like about vet med. We can let our pets exit this world gracefully, but I won't go too much into that whole debate.

couchon said:

It's not about the OWNER - my whole belief, and I understand you disagree, is that the decision is to be made in the best interest of the animal ONLY, regardless of finances. And to whoever said they themselves would simply want to die quietly, maybe that's the difference too. I would want to keep on fighting and have someone fight for me until the bitter end.

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It's obvious we all have our wants when faced with a medical crisis. There is no wrong or right but a personal preference. I've seen both sides--- hanging on to a loved one who is in bed with 0 quality of life in pain with little hope of getting better to those who feel or perhaps even know from the family member that they don't want to go on. My grandpa was told maybe a year or two and he was like let me go. I'm in a lot of pain and I can't take it anymore. Now an animal isn't able to understand what's going on and whether there's hope or not. They just know the right now, minute by minute. We as owners need to decide for them just like you do a family member who is unable to speak for themselves. I know for a fact that if there is little hope for them there is no way they'd want us to bankrupt ourselves to keep going on a minute to minute basis. I don't think it's right to judge anyone for their decision because it's up to the families and their loved one how they want to handle their situation no matter how bad or uncaring it looks to the public.

couchon said:

What bothers me is separation between pets and family. I think pets ARE family. Would you not get medical treatment for a family member if it meant putting family finances in jeopardy?

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If your child needs medical care and so does your guinea pig, then do you split your available credit in half between them?

Again, even though I don't personally believe in euthanasia, I can respect that decision if it's made for the animal, not because of finances. And I feel some people use euthanasia as a way to ease their own burden (both financial or emotional), and I think that's wrong - this is not directed at any of the posters, just one other thing that bothers me. And I believe animals are all different too. Just like some people want to hang on to the end, I believe some animals do too. I think euthanasia has become too much of the default option.

My children will always trump my pets.

I love my animals and will do what I feel is right within reason for them but going deep into debt to the point of leveraging a home or retirement account and placing my family in financial jeopardy for many years to come is not within reason, in my opinion. In the past 6 months I have spent around 5,000 dollars on vet bills for my animals, most of that on the dog. The animals were injured or ill and we took them to the vet. The treatment was within reason and the out come in all cases was very good. This was also a cost we could afford. Most of the costs were small bills spread out over time which were simply cash flowed with the monthly budget. The big costs like Rudy's cancer surgeries came from the vet account. I just took Rudy back today for his recheck and the vet thought he was doing awesome. I'm very happy to hear that I will not have to go back to the vet until his vaccines are due. As much as I love our vet, I'm getting tired of seeing her. lol

Cavy_idas, that's about the ONLY situation in which I would even consider spending less than the piggy needs, but if it's anything less than husband/child with a LIFE-threatening situation, I think a LIFE-threatening situation for a piggy takes priority

couchon said:

Again, even though I don't personally believe in euthanasia, I can respect that decision if it's made for the animal, not because of finances. And I feel some people use euthanasia as a way to ease their own burden (both financial or emotional), and I think that's wrong - this is not directed at any of the posters, just one other thing that bothers me. And I believe animals are all different too. Just like some people want to hang on to the end, I believe some animals do too. I think euthanasia has become too much of the default option.

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But finances can be tied into what's right for the animal. Are you going to let a pet suffer painfully from a medical condition (ex. blocked cats) you can't afford to treat or let it go peacefully? They're not necessarily mutually exclusive.

@Inle_Rabbit, totally off topic but love your dog's name. We just lost our corgi, named Rudy, to unexpected heart failure that was probably due to a neurodegenerative condition he had. We didn't spend the money to confirm it because it does not have a good prognosis and even if it was something else, we were unsure if we'd proceed since he's a jerk at the vet, was 12 years old and was in the early stages of kidney disease. Glad to hear that your Rudy seems to be doing better!

I think the obligation is to find the money in that situation or if it's completely impossible try to find someone who will spend the money. But again, I don't think it's right to euthanize for any problem that can be solved with money. And if you get an animalyou should think ahead of time if you can afford to spend thousand of dollars - that's what it comes back to.

@couchon, but with this economy, other's aren't necessarily going to be willing to hand you money, especially if they don't put as much value on pets as you do. Also, some conditions such as hepatic shunts, may require repeated surgeries to insure it's working possibly. A client at our teaching hospital had to drop $10+ grand at a single time for the FIRST surgery and it ended up needing a follow up surgery to adjust the shunt more appropriately. You can't predict for procedures for that since there is no way to know ahead of time when purchasing/adopting an animal that you're going to face those problems.

Personally, I fully support euthanasias, even ones out of convenience because I don't know what will happen to the animal if the euthanasia isn't performed. The owner could just completely neglect it or dump it somewhere outside. I'd rather give it a peaceful rests than risk the potential of it being neglected and left in pain. A lot of my classmates don't agree with me and I think a lot of it is because I've worked in a practice that deals with shelter animals and a lot of people who have a limited income so I've faced financial issues since day one of my job. It's not easy, but I have to do what's best for the animal with what is given to me.

All the more reason not to take on animals if you don't have savings, a line of credit, a house, anything to cover these possibilities. And if you don't and this comes up, just fight as hard as you can I guess. Try to get on the local news. Call vets all over the country and plead for them to take your animal pro Bono. I am not saying any of this will work, but you have to fight as hard as you can - start selling things (TV, cell phone, computer ), try to get a part time job in a vet office for a discount on surgery and don't take any pay.....

couchon said:

All the more reason not to take on animals if you don't have savings, a line of credit, a house, anything to cover these possibilities. And if you don't and this comes up, just fight as hard as you can I guess. Try to get on the local news. Call vets all over the country and plead for them to take your animal pro Bono. I am not saying any of this will work, but you have to fight as hard as you can - start selling things (TV, cell phone, computer ), try to get a part time job in a vet office for a discount on surgery and don't take any pay.....

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As was stated above, it depends on the circumstances, the pets and your family, as to how far you will go. You are not going to get everyone to agree with you that you are to sell you life basically to try and save your pet who is in pain and it's not being fixed in affordable ways for that person. Your passion is great and you'd make a great vet. Have you ever thought of going in the field?

@Mowgs - Thank you! Rudy is doing much better. Poor guy has been through the ringer recently. All of this started 6 months ago with a strange tumor growing from his gums. We took him to the vet and she wanted to remove it that day and send it off for testing. The mass came back as acanthomatous epulis. The vet recommended a lower mandibulectomy. In between the first and second surgery Rudy started to act odd, (coughing, peeing in the house and being lethargic) and our vet was concerned the cancer had spread to his heart. After x-rays and blood tests he was diagnosed with hypothyroidism. The best out of all the possible diagnosis we were given. He also had a pancreatic flare up shortly after the hypothyroid diagnosis. Once he was over those humps he finally went in for his mandibulectomy a few weeks ago. He came through like a champ and is doing so much better.