Stones Possible painful stone...a Actigall® (Ursodiol) to help?

snickers33 · Jan 13, 2016

Our beloved pig, Snickers, seems to be battling a bladder stone. He will be five years next month and throughout his young life, he has overcome many URI's and mites as a young pup.

Currently, he is on Bactrim and Metacam for a possible UTI.

About a month ago, I noticed his eyes were more wide and he did not look as relaxed. He was frequently urinating, the urine smelled very strongly and he had pinkish urine.

I took him to the vet in another state, (visiting family for Christmas) and they wanted to do an x-ray, which was $90 and we did not want to spend that much (spent a total of $111)

Instead, she gave us pain meds for him until we could visit a vet in Maryland.

The second vet visit (spent $95) wanted to do urine analysis and an x ray but my husband and I just wanted to try anti biotics to rule out a UTI.

Well, a week later the blood in the urine has been on and off. Recently, there hasn't been blood.

Yet, we think its a bladder stone. He squeaks in pain, curling his bottom slightly under as in doing a crunch exercise, and within a second he stops. He is still on the generic metacam but the squeaking has not stopped.

He is eating and drinking fine.
He is playful and affectionate.

We don't want to put him down when most of the time he is acting so normally.

can Actigall® (Ursodiol) be used in this situation?

What would you do in my place? (Given that he is an older pig but he is so healthy without this stone!)

The vet is not in until Monday so we are waiting to hear if she will call us on her off time.

bpatters · Jan 13, 2016

I would take him to a good exotic vet before that stone blocks his urethra and he dies of a very painful blockage.

None of the things you mention will help, and may actually hurt. He needs surgery to remove the stone, and if he's in otherwise good health, there's no reason not to do it. It's not a terribly difficult surgery, and most pigs do very well afterward.

You need to put back some money for vet care for your pig. You've had two vets give you very good recommendations on diagnosing whether it's a stone, but you haven't taken either one of them. I don't know how much money you've saved, but your pig has been in pain the whole time. Responsible pet care means providing for medical care as well as food and bedding, and he depends on you for everything.

There are plenty of exotic vets around you. Please find one and get him in for treatment.

CavyMama · Jan 13, 2016

$90 is not a lot to spend when it comes to medical treatment for your guinea pig. I once gladly paid $500 to have a tumor removed on one of my boars. Then paid $800 to have it removed when it grew back and turned out to be cancer. You know why I GLADLY paid it? Because it meant that my pig would live. A stone is serious and very painful for your pig. Doing nothing is not an option.

Rywen · Jan 13, 2016

@snickers33 I live in Montgomery County, not sure where you are in MD but I can recommend 2 vets here if you're interested. Probably the best gp vet in MD is Dr. Keith Gold at Chadwell Animal Hospital just north of Baltimore, he's the vet for the Metropolitan Guinea Pig Rescue. I also had to take Penny to Pender Exotics in Fairfax one weekend (open 24hrs), surprisingly their fees were less than their regular exotics vet.

snickers33 · Jan 13, 2016

Thank you for your non condescending post. Glad to hear your piggy did well and is still with you!

Because of the price and risks of the stones reappearing, we may choose to euthanize him. We love him very much and we will prayerfully consider what to do.

snickers33 · Jan 13, 2016

We are down near Annapolis. Thank you for your kind, gracious response. I will discuss this with my husband.

Rywen · Jan 13, 2016

Oh, just a thought, an exotics vet on the Eastern shore may be less expensive, if you're willing to drive to Easton, etc.

snickers33 · Jan 14, 2016

Rywen said:
Oh, just a thought, an exotics vet on the Eastern shore may be less expensive, if you're willing to drive to Easton, etc.

Snickers does have a bladder stone...another vet visit was $224.

($180 for x ray!? Why is that even charged?)

We are calling around to check prices on surgery.

bpatters · Jan 14, 2016

That does sound outrageous for an x-ray. They're about $40-$60 at my vet.

But I have recently discovered that some vets submit x-rays to a radiologist for reading, and that really inflates the charges. I can see the need for that if the vet isn't sure what the problem is when s/he looks at the x-ray, but there's not much room for doubt when dealing with a stone. I've started asking my vet not to send x-rays out before talking with me first, and us deciding together whether it's really necessary.

snickers33 · Jan 14, 2016

his stone

snickers33 · Jan 14, 2016

ThePigAlchemist said:
I agree, that does seem high for an x-ray. I am in Maryland as well, pretty close to you. I go to a vet in Laurel who charges just over 100 dollars for an x-ray.

Best of luck in finding a vet to do the surgery. I hope everything goes well.

how much was the stone surgery and who did the surgery?

snickers33 · Jan 14, 2016

That's a reasonable number. The vet today said well over $1000. how soon can it be done?

snickers33 · Jan 14, 2016

I am calling them now to get an estimate. It would be less since I already have an x ray?

snickers33 · Jan 14, 2016

Yes, just called and they are busy so he will give me a call with the estimate asap. Is there anything that was overpriced that I don't have to get? any advice you would give me?

bpatters · Jan 14, 2016

It depends on the size of the stone as to whether they'll do another x-ray. Also on the sex of the guinea pig. A sow can often pass small stones, so they'll do an x-ray just before they put her to sleep to make sure they're not operating for nothing. With larger stones, and with males, who usually can't pass a stone, they don't always do that.

But do get it done as soon as you can schedule it with a good vet. Stones can fall into the urethra and block the passage of urine. That's a very painful medical emergency that you want to avoid if at all possible.

snickers33 · Jan 14, 2016

So, have you checked if the stones came back? How long ago did you get the surgery?

snickers33 · Jan 14, 2016

bpatters said:
It depends on the size of the stone as to whether they'll do another x-ray. Also on the sex of the guinea pig. A sow can often pass small stones, so they'll do an x-ray just before they put her to sleep to make sure they're not operating for nothing. With larger stones, and with males, who usually can't pass a stone, they don't always do that.

But do get it done as soon as you can schedule it with a good vet. Stones can fall into the urethra and block the passage of urine. That's a very painful medical emergency that you want to avoid if at all possible.

Yes, this is why I would like to get it done tomorrow or Saturday.

bpatters · Jan 14, 2016

Make sure they send him home with pain medication -- and he really needs two. One for immediate pain in the 24 hours after the surgery, and then something milder for a couple of days after that.

Read https://www.guinealynx.info/postop.html for more on how to care for him afterwards.

snickers33 · Jan 14, 2016

bpatters said:
Make sure they send him home with pain medication -- and he really needs two. One for immediate pain in the 24 hours after the surgery, and then something milder for a couple of days after that.

Read https://www.guinealynx.info/postop.html for more on how to care for him afterwards.

hes on Meloxicam now....is there something they will give him that is more powerful?

bpatters · Jan 14, 2016

They'll probably give him buprenorphine right after the surgery. It controls pain very well, but really zonks a pig out, and you don't want to give it any longer than it's needed. Meloxicam is fine for the couple of days after surgery.

Most vets will prescribe one dose every 24 hours, but most people I know get better pain control by giving slightly more than half the dose every 12 hours. It just won't control the pain for a full 24 hours, and a pig in pain usually won't eat. That can set the pig up for GI stasis and bloat, and you certainly don't want that.

You can talk to your vet about it when they send him home, but my vet prefers the smaller dose every 12 hours rather than the larger 24 hour dose.

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