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Getting Along Better Diplomacy with People who NEED us!

Baby Bears

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I know I may get a huge earful for this, but I can't help noticing the way people react when an unsuspecting person arrives on this forum with a pregnant pig and needing help.

I know breeding of piggies is bad. I know it's especially bad to breed skinnies, but jumping on these people when they come here is contrary to what we are trying to do. Aren't we trying to educate people coming here? That's why I came here. I had to have a very tough skin when I first came on this forum, because I bought my boys from a pet store and was berated for it. I didn't know any better and have since learned. Luckily, I am older and have the ability to have a tough skin. Alot of people who come here may be younger and more easily intimidated.

Let's take the recent thread by JenkaJoe - yeah She Messed up! Big time! However, instead of helping her (and thus her pigs) and educating her not to do it again, she was attacked first and then given advice and may not come back here now. How in the world are we going to educate people and help people if they are run off the second they get here? It's okay to say what you feel, but only after you have the person understanding that we will most definately help, then you can tell them about breeding being wrong, etc. We need to help them FIRST. I know alot of you have alot of passion, but you need to learn when it is proper and the proper way to let it out. We are losing people that could have been helped and in turn, losing their pigs too!
 

Myspoiltpiggies

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I agree with you. I was attacked when I came here becuase I told everyone I bred guinea pigs. I remember someone saying just listen to what everyone is saying, but all they were doing was throwing insults at me and hurting me.. then I got banned! I was trying to get off the subject by posting on threads that had nothing to do with breeding.. and yet I still got banned. I'd only ever bred twice then.. and I was 13. Now, I don't breed, because I *was* taking in everything that people were saying. but I think we should go about a bit more friendlier. I didn't realise what I was doing was wrong.. and the way I was told was also wrong!
 

VoodooJoint

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I re-read the threads that Jenka posted in. Personally I do not see an attack going on. She was told that this is an anti-breeding website and that breeding is not a good idea.

Statements like that inform people that we will not be supportive if they continue to breed. Once warned, if they continue to support breeding, then we know better how to deal with the situation. No one here wants to "play" with breeders.

Believe me Jenka is not gone. Hopefully she has read the posts after she realized her mistake. We have encouraged her to stick around and learn more rather then get more bad advice from breeders.

If she is willing to learn and realize her error (we all have made them) she will probably become very knowledgable about GPs and an advocate for the rescue effort.

Her GP is pregnant. There is nothing we can do to change that. Now the plan is to help insure that her babies are born with the best chance of survival.

So Jenka...if you are out there...stay around. This really is a great bunch of people. We are simply passionate about rescuing over breeding/buying. If it's true that you have no plans to breed further then the issue of breeding is over...now comes the fun stuff....learning about how to make your pets' lives great.
 

Baby Bears

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I'm glad Jenka is still around. She's got quite a challenge coming with babies who are going to be part skinny pig.

I know it wasn't a vicious attack on her, but the first things said are "this is an anit-breeding forum...." Some people are more sensitive than others. To some, that seems like no biggie, to others, it hurts. She seemed like she was going to go away until you, VOODOO, told her to please stay so we could help her! That's what we need more of.

I just wanted to ask everyone to try and remember we all have the same goal - EDUCATION IS THE KEY!
 

kat_0521

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I posted in the thread you are talking about. I tried educating on what needed to be done to help her out. I hope no one felt that I was attacking JenkaJoe- that was just the opposite of my posting there. Sorry if I offended BabyBears , Jenka or any of the mods.
 

Access

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I think the thread in question was more-or-less purely informative / educational. No one seemed to be posting out of mean-spiritedness or as an attempt to ridicule.

But I don't know if introducing the forum as anti-breeding is proper. Anti-breeding is not an opinion or a belief, it is simply one of the many logical conclusions that come from putting the welfare of our pigs first. If we say 'this forum is anti-breeding' it makes it sound like this is some rule imposed from the outside and that anyone that has been breeding is not welcome here.

A better introduction would be something like "This is a forum for people who love and care about their pigs" and go on to explain about the different facts this leads to -- pigs like being kept with other pigs; pigs need floor time, fresh vegetables, personal attention; breeding is hurtful to the pigs themselves; the horrors of the pet industry; pigs need appropiately sized cages; etc. That demonstrates that these thigns are not opinions of some outside administrator imposed on the forum / group but they are just the logical conclusion of caring for our pigs.

Most people who have come here from the dark side are a bit shocked at everything they have done / are doing wrong so of course there will be a tendency to run back to their older, wrong, anti-pig places simply because they are more comfortable there. I don't think we can help everyone who comes here, but we can at least try.
 

Baby Bears

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YOu know Access, you're right. I had my boys for about two weeks before I found this site. I THOUGHT I was doing okay by them... but I wasn't. After going through this site (and Guinea Lynx) I had to reevaluate their home, food, etc. Of course, that was only better for them and they benefitted HUGELY from it!
 

VoodooJoint

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The bulk of the problem lies in the people who join and immediatly start posting. This may be ideal if there is a medical or behavioral issue that puts your pets at risk but not ideal for an owner looking for a support group.

If people who join would read though the sites, the sticky threads and the forums before posting they would have no doubt that this site is anti-petshop/breeding/buying/small cage/etc...

I read this site for months before I joined and posted. When I finally did post I already knew the main people on the forum, the rules and what this forum is all about. Everything this forum stood for was already part of my belief system. I guess I expect others to do the same...at least for a little while.
 

LuvMyPiggers

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I agree. We can't just go banning people for that reason. I believe we should give them a chance to get educated. If they continue making a nuisnace, then I believe is the right time for banning.
 

Access

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Actually banning is pretty rare, I don't believe there's been a lot of people banned here and most of the time it's a repeat offender (someone who is already banned trying to sign up under a different ip / isp).
 

VoodooJoint

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A total of 44 people have been banned.

25 of those names were repeat offenders that kept coming back.

At least 2 were breeders that had no intention of stopping.

At least 8 were trolls/spammers

Banning is not common. It's just such a big deal when someone is banned that it seems like more.
 
Winnie
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VoodooJoint

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What story Winnie?
 

nancy

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Access said:
Most people who have come here from the dark side...

I'm sorry, but with all of this Star Wars stuff going on, when you said "dark side" it just cracked me up. I got this image of people with breading guinea pigs in a long-darth-vader-like cloak....

but you are completley right, I also thought I was doing right with my guinea pigs before I came to this site. I think compassion is always the first step. :)
 

Ly&Pigs

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The only thing I have to add is that this forum is privately owned and run by Teresa. She has the right to put anti-breeding on her private forum because she pays for the web space. I think it might be different if it was a public forum.

About banning, I don't ban for no reason. I ban if I feel the person has total disregard for forum rules and has been repeatedly warned. I can say this on banning, for those who have been warned at least twice about using proper punctuation, capitalization, and not following the other proper posting etiquette's, they will start getting banned for 1 week. I feel a permanent ban is not warrented for that, but I feel they need some type of consequence major enough to make them realize that they have to follow the rules.
 

CavySpirit

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I'd like to perfectly clear about something. No one is banned simply because they are a breeder. We have plenty of members who are breeders on this forum. What you do in the privacy of your own home is your business, isn't it? It's when forum rules are broken and broken flagrantly that bans are imposed. If you want to PROMOTE breeding or promote pet stores, etc., then you are clearly on the wrong forum.

Access, "Anti-breeding is not an opinion or a belief, it is simply one of the many logical conclusions that come from putting the welfare of our pigs first." This is an interesting point. It's one that I feel strongly about. I'd like to continue this idea on another thread. The thing is that these issues do cross over into in complex belief systems. BUT, absolutely, from a logic point of view--assuming you put animal welfare first--breeding is logically indefensible. It's why the breeders retreat into character attacks, closed lists & censorship.
 

LuvMyPiggers

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I've come to a conclusion. To see both sides of it, you can't really have a right or wrong answer. Yes, forums (Not just us) shouldn't attack new members because they don't have two pigs, a C&C, they breed or they show. But then again, they shouldn't talk about it alot, properly get banned, and raise hell on the board under a new name.
 

widallas

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It's a great thing in life when you realize if you don't like someone's opinions, you don't really have to listen them.... I have come to the conclusion, too, that although I may not agree with people's opinions all the time on the forums, I have gotten a LOT more information from here than I ever could have any other place. You all of been very upfront and honest about your goals and objectives, and if I feel a conversation is getting to heated or one-sided for me, I've found this magical little button on the mouse that can make it all just...["poof"]...goooo awaaaay, and off to the next, more innocuous thread I merrily go! I think that people are much more open to new ideas and opinions when not shoved down their throats, true....and the more information you can spread about guinea pigs the better. But, as someone pointed out, this is a forum/site started and maintained by very passionate people. They didn't solicit new members into the forum for bashing -- we all came looking for info.
 
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