Henry and Lady

Please separate the guinea pigs now. Haphazardly breeding is irresponsible and dangerous for the animals. There are plenty of animals dying in shelters, no one needs to be adding more. Besides, if you continually house them together then you will continually be having babies being born. The females can, and will, get pregnant again immediately after giving birth. This means that they will almost always be pregnant and nursing pups. This is extremely taxing on their poor little bodies (as if one litter wasn't hard enough) and you will kill them.

You also said in another post that you think that they are about 1 year old. That is too old for a female to begin breeding. Female GP's pelvic tendons stiffen and it becomes difficult for the pelvic bones to spread properly during birthing,. This means that the babies stand a good chance of becoming stuck inside the mother or doing traumatic damage to the female on their way out of the birth canal. Both instances usually result in death after immense suffering.

I also have to wonder why you would want to create more and more animals when you state that you suffer from allergies and are "trying everything to make this pet ownership thing work". If nothing works and you decide you can no longer keep the animals wouldn't 2 animal be easier to rehome then 10 or 20? Wouldn't less animals have less of an impact on your allergies?

Please, do the right thing and protect these animals from the trauma of unnecessary reproduction and the possibility of being rehomes because you and your allergies become overwhelmed. Don't allow them to breed.

https://www.guinealynx.info/breeding.html

More reasons not to breed, but VJ pretty much said it all.

(From GL) One ARBA judge estimates that complications from breeding will kill one in 5 sows.

Do you really want to take that chance? It is very unwise to breed. It is extremely stressful on the poor sow. If you want more pigs, just adopt more, do not support the overpopulation.

Please, don't breed them.

Now is the time for you to get educated about the basics. There is a vast pet animal overpopulation problem (caused in part by people who don't know much about the pets they buy or otherwise acquire).

I hope you do commit long-term to these animals and, if they don't 'work', you won't just say "Oh, well!" and get rid of them.

Please separate the animals until you can be sure they are the same sex. Guinea pigs are so rewarding, as you already are learning (good for you). But the rewards come with serious responsibilities for your animals' health and medical care, more than you realize right now with your idea that you can just let them breed and let the chips fall where they may.

Why do you want to breed?

There are so many homeless pigs out there and you will likely kill your sow and any babies. Are you prepared to find dead babies in the cage one day?

I'm sure that would upset your kids at least Breeding Guinea Pigs

If you don't know how to sex pigs or the genetics or history of these pigs, you really have no business breeding - do you know if you have roans? What if you end up with a litter of lethals? Or a line prone to heart disease?

You prepared to handfeed blind, deaf and toothless babies three times daily? Or medicate them?

Wow! A lot of flack here for keeping two guinea pigs together that might be male and female! Last night I was researching how to tell the genders apart and I'm fairly positive we have 2 girlies.
But if we were to have babies, then, yes, I'm prepared for all of the above risks. Thank you, all, for your concerns.

No, I would not leave Henry, should he really be a boy, with Lady if she were to become pregnant. I agree that would be cruel to Lady to breed her over and over and over again.
As of right now I only have one cage. But I am currently in the process of making a C&C. When that happens, I will be able to divide the two should the need arise.
Ah, yes, Voodoo. I know about the pelvic bones of the female piggie fusing. However, Lady has been bred before. And as Henry and Lady were kept together by their former owner before I took them, I see no problem in continuing to keep them together until I can put together better accomodations.

Touche, Voodoo. However, the area in which we live already has my nose running and eyes itching so that I, personally, see no change in my health by adding a few pets. As of right now, Henry and Lady have their own room. So the fur or hay or whatever causes sneezing is extremely cut down. Honestly? I haven't noticed any (extra) allergy symptoms since they've arrived. Eventually I'd like to move them to the living area where they can see us better. Maybe then I'll see an increase in allergy symptoms. But I've been dealing with it for years now and can't see them causing such an affect that I would ditch them.
I've noticed several people on this forum have allergies but still have piggies. I'm sorry if my earlier post came across badly. My thoughts on sharing my health issues was to say that, no matter what, we will not be getting rid of Henry(etta?) and Lady. Just like the many others here who refuse to give up on their pets. And if we were to have babies, we would keep them all...unless a close friend wanted to take one (preferably two) as pets.

I personally think it would be an amazing thing to have little baby guineas. But I don't plan on having them mate incessantly. Thus the (upcoming) cage where, like many others here, we will be able to seperate the boy(s) and girl(s).

Thank you, everyone, for looking out for Henry and Lady. One of the reasons I came to this forum was to get as much information on how to take care of these guys (gals?) to the best of my ability. There are a few things I disagree with y'all about, but I hope that won't alienate me from the group too much.

Do you think you're allergic to the guinea pigs or have outdoor allergies? We got our pigs in February and I'm having a lot of allergy issues, but I know that the pollen count is excessively high where I live right now so it isn't the GPs. I've allergy tested and I'm not allergic to animals, only just about everything outdoors.

I did get Oxbow Orchard grass to feed as hay because I'd read it was better for people with allergies. I really didn't have any problems with the Timothy hay, but I didn't want to invite allergy issues.

Another thing is an air filter. I've thought about getting a couple for my home just for use when the pollen is high. Even keeping the windows shut and the a/c on I am miserable right now. Again, I know it is not the guinea pigs because I've been allergy tested.

I hope you have two GPs of the same gender. I know nothing about breeding, but from what I understand they can reproduce rapidly. I wouldn't want to deal with it myself.

Just so you know, this is an anti-breeding, pro-rescue site. The founder of the site runs a guinea pig rescue. Even if you breed them once, you're considered a backyard breeder. I really don't see how you cannot "alienate" yourself from the group.

Please separate them until you are sure they are same sex.

Ah, for some reason I didn't catch that this was an anti-breeding site. I read a lot of people who were against it, but I didn't know it was forbidden.

Again, Henry and Lady were given to me together. In the same cage. Whatever "damage" that's been done, is done. So I don't see any point in separating them right now.

Since I seem to have a slightly different take on animals, it looks as if I may need to find a new forum. Thanks y'all for your time and insights.

Gestation is 59 to 73 days. The sows can only get pregnant when they are in heat. So she may not be pregnant yet .. if you keep them together, she will be so it will be intentional on your part.

Pleading ignorance doesn't work.

Genipher said:

Again, Henry and Lady were given to me together. In the same cage. Whatever "damage" that's been done, is done. So I don't see any point in separating them right now.

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As has been stated, the damage might not be done if they are opposite sex. I have heard of male and female pairs living together for over a year before the female became pregnant.

Further damage can also be done if she were to give birth while the male is still in the cage with her as the male could impregnate her again immediately.

I don't understand why people think it's acceptable to breed together two animals they know NOTHING about. You don't know their genetics or health history. You don't know if they were properly fed so they would develop normally while they were young. I cannot fathom why you would think breeding them would be a good idea at all. The only reason I can find is that you think it would be fun and "an amazing thing to have little baby guineas". In my opinion that reason is not good enough. You aren't breeding to improve health or genetics. Breeding for "fun" is only fun for you. Not for the animals, not for the rescues and shelters that have to clean up the mess.

It certainly isn't amazing when there are birth complications and you have to deal with the bloody, tragic aftermath. Of course the humans always manage to get over it...the animals are usually dead or suffering.

PLEASE, separate them until you have absolute confirmation of their sexes. If they are opposite sexes then keep them separated unless you are going to neuter the male.

President of the ACBA admits to knowingly creating "lethals" and then feeds said lethals to his pet snakes
Purposeful breeding results in stillborns and heartbroken owner
First litter one baby dies. Second litter all babies and mom die
One baby dead. Mom dead of toxemia
Lots of dead babies
Breeder dumps stud at a petstore once it is no longer useful
(broken link removed)(broken link removed)
Petco/Petsmart Breeder/Supplier Retires and Dumps His Herd of over 500 Guinea pigs
Rescued sow delivers one live, one dead, and dies of prolapsed uterus
Petstore Bought Pig Delivers One Stillborn, One Malformed and One Live Baby
Breeder's Poor Practices Result in Genetic Defects and the Death of One Baby
Missexed Pigs leads to Pregnancy, Prolapsed Uterus and Bowel. Mother GP and one Baby Die.

I don't see how anybody can think breeding is a good idea. Apart from the fact that rescues are overrun with all breeds of animals, cats, dogs, and small animals alike, it is not a walk in the park.

Anybody that has had children before knows how painful and exhausting the birthing process is. Just because our pets don't make a huge fuss like humans do, hollering for drugs, doesn't mean it is any less hard on them. Complications are common, mothers and babies can die. We go to a hospital and deliver, in other countries human mothers and babies still die of child birth. Animals are no different. If somebody claims to love a pet, how can they expose the poor animal to the excruciating labor and delivery and the risk of loosing the pet and the babies?

I don't really have anything to add, everyone hit it on the money.

I am not pro breeding, but I think it is a bit extreme to call someone who breeds once a "backyard breeder." I used to be on the board of directors of a local dog rescue. I've seen first hand what true backyard breeders are. They have a complete lack of regard for the animals and are only in it for the money.

Again, I agree that these guinea pigs should be separated until gender is determined. I know that you saw that you'll keep the babies if they do reproduce, but those babies can then reproduce and it will be an endless cycle. I've heard that a boar can impregnate his mother when he is very young. I know zilch about how guinea pig breeding works, but it seems like they can breed very rapidly.

A backyard breeder is also someone who breeds without knowledge of what they are really doing. Someone who just puts random pigs together and hopes for babies, someone who does not know the history or genetics of the pigs they are trying to breed. It doesn't matter if they do it once or a hundred times over, they are still a backyard breeder.

Whew! Okay. Let's try this again. Leaving any scripture reference(s) out of it, of course!

It is my personal belief (I can say belief, right?) that humans are to be in charge of animals. I also believe we are to take care of them. However, I don't see how allowing animals to have one litter is irresponsible. Especially since I've already said I would take care of the babies.

Lil Fellas Mom: I've had children and I understand the pain of childbirth. I am not convinced, however, that animals feel the same pain we do bearing children.
A loving owner might allow their animals to experience "the pain" of birth for many reasons. Educational purposes. Fun. Companionship for themselves or other pigs...

You know, my husband loves me (and I love me, too) but we still allow ourselves (okay, me!) to go through the pain of childbirth. It is such a rewarding experience to hold that little baby in your arms! I don't know that animals have that same sense of satisfaction or joy...but it is inbred in them to procreate. Why would we take that away from them? It's funny (not funny haha, but funny strange) to me that so many people scream about animal rights, but then don't let them have the right to mate.
I've often wondered what the future will be like, since we neuter and spay everything that moves. That, or forcefully keep animals apart to prevent conception...
I know right now there are many unwanted and neglected animals. But that doesn't mean the future will be the same. If we don't allow animals to mate, will there be any left in the future?

utsarah: Yes, I was also of the opinion that a "backyard breeder" was one that bred an animal over and over again for profit. I guess that term, like so many others, has been twisted into a new meaning.
Thank you for the information on the young boars mating with the mothers. I had read that already, but it's always good to pass along information--you never know who might not know.
Isn't it an awesome thing that the young guineas are born running and ready to eat? It makes it so much easier to seperate them into gender-specific cages at 2-3 weeks, eh? It makes it so much easier to make sure the males don't impregnate sisters or mother.
Also, utsarah, thank you for your sympathy to allergies. Pollen, mold, dogs and cats seem to be my triggers. I assumed the guineas would be a trigger, as well, but I (coincidentally) caught a cold right when we brought the two home. I think I assumed it was them instead of a cold bug. Since getting over the cold, I'm able to sit in the pig room and I'm perfectly fine. Yay! An animal that doesn't make me miserable!
We have air purifiers and dehumidfiers. I take stinging nettle, and, occasionally, the off-brand of Claritan. Lately I've been feeling much better. But I've changed my diet (going gluten and milk-free) so maybe that's helped.

When I am able to get my C&C cage together (I'm still waiting for Walmart to deliver my cubes), I'll be able to construct a bigger and better home for Henry and Lady. I agree with and exhalt all those that are able to rescue guinea pigs. With a bigger cage (and a willing husband) I hope to one day do the same.

As of right now I am unable to seperate Henry and Lady. So if they really are male and female, hopefully she'll stay barren (as Voodoo says is possible) until I can get them each a same-gender buddy and seperate them accordingly. Perhaps I'll even be able to adopt babies one day and enjoy the fun of little ones scampering around.
If Lady gives birth, we will celebrate the young ones arrival, seperate genders as needed, and take care of them "until death do we part".

I have appreciated the information on this forum. I apologize again for not being up-to-date on the rules (no religious talk, no breeding!). I didn't mean to open this can of worms!!
I hope to learn more from this, and other guinea pig forums, so that we can take the best possible care of Henry (or is it Henrietta?) and Lady.
Thank you.

PS. Henry and Lady were "rescued" from a woman that bred Lady to supply the local pet shop...I don't know that Henry was used to stud, but I do know that Lady has been a mama before.

PPSS. or is it PSS or PPS...hmmm...Anywho, does this thread need to be moved to the kitchen?? I meant it as an introduction and it's blown a bit out of control...Mods?

Genipher,
Welcome, I hope you will take good care of Henry and Lady. Have you even tried to find out their sexes? A good vet could tell you, but really I didn't have that hard a time figuring it out myself. Especially if they are older. If you are going to try and have babies if Lady happens to get pregnant, you need to know how to sex very young guinea pigs, so you can remove the males at three weeks. Seems like Henry and Lady would be good practice.
https://www.guinealynx.info/sexing_pups.html

I am in no way condoning breeding your guinea pigs. You just seem clueless as to the sex of the two you have and I don't see why you'd want to bring more into the equation until you learn how to tend to the two you have.
I wish you luck with Henry and Lady.

Your intent is to breed these guinea pigs that you don't know the genetics of let alone true genders.

That makes you a breeder. You certainly are not a reputable breeder doing it to better the breed. You just want "cute wittle babies"... maybe you should read https://www.guinealynx.info/forums/viewtopic.php?t=56857

That poster breed two random pet store pigs together and ended up with a special needs baby because they had no idea what they were doing. I could give you a long list of disaster threads.

And separate the babies at 2 weeks? Uh huh. Males are actually fertile at 3 weeks ie 21 days so you'd be removing them one week too early. And you want to breed.

You can't be half-arsed to separate the supposed parents now yet you can separate and keep all the babies in the future. How exactly does that work?

Oh it doesn't. And if by miracle the sow and all the babies survive - let's say you have 6-8 babies. You want to keep them all for the next 6-8 years.

That is 6 to 8 guinea pigs at your local kill shelter that you could have adopted instead.

And what if the babies have heart conditions and maloclussion which can be common in poorly bred guinea pigs? Are you going to medicate and handfeed them daily for the next several years?

And remember you can't be bothered to get another cage or separate the parents now.

Babies born running may be cute to you but it is really hard on the sow's body and guaranteed to decrease her lifespan esp. if she has already had litters.

A breeder is a breeder. And many times they don't care about money.

They just want little babies or can't be bothered to separate or neuter their pets like this poster.

utsarah said:

I am not pro breeding, but I think it is a bit extreme to call someone who breeds once a "backyard breeder." I used to be on the board of directors of a local dog rescue. I've seen first hand what true backyard breeders are. They have a complete lack of regard for the animals and are only in it for the money.

Again, I agree that these guinea pigs should be separated until gender is determined. I know that you saw that you'll keep the babies if they do reproduce, but those babies can then reproduce and it will be an endless cycle. I've heard that a boar can impregnate his mother when he is very young. I know zilch about how guinea pig breeding works, but it seems like they can breed very rapidly.

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I would highly suggest separating them at this point, until you know for sure what the sexes are. You say the one female was bred before. Who was she bred with? Did the previous owner say she was bred with the pig you have now?

This really saddens me that you want to breed these guys, and you did say that was your intention in your original post. Have you called shelters in your area and even checked craigslist? Have you seen all of the guinea pigs for adoption? I know in my area there is at least 1 post on craigslist daily with piggies for adoption and the shelters around here have a whole bunch to. Its really a shame that you want to breed them, even knowing all the risks.