Why can't we all get along?

[princesspoppy]

Originally Posted by sdpiggylvr

Rabbits need 2 cups of vegetables per day, but many people don't feed that much because rabbits have been proven to live healthy lives without having veggies. I know the guinea pigs aren't rabbits but it's a similar concept, to me. I do feed them veggies daily, so it's not like I'm doing a "huge disservice" to them. The veggies I feed them amounts to about a cup per pig.
What I feed my guinea pigs is what I feed my guinea pigs. I'm sorry, but they're just Guinea pigs

1st....Where is your proof that it's "proven"that Rabbits live healthy lives without veggies.
2nd....You said on chat several days ago that you feed under a cup
of veggies. And YES, you are doing a huge diservice to your pigs.
3rd...."just pigs" are you kidding me.

[Paula]

Originally Posted by sdpiggylvr

Okay, to answer your question about my guinea pigs' diet, Ly&Pigs, I honestly don't know why I feel it's unnecessary.

Since their lives, healthfulness, and well being rather depend on it, I'm surprised you'd be so lackadaisical about your reason for not doing it. I'd have expected something like, "My vet disagrees," "I've found research that suggests otherwise," ... something other than, "Ah, I dunno." To me that just sounds lazy, like you can't be bothered to find a reason to take a serious approach either way but rather, just don't want to be bothered with doing what's best because it's perhaps inconvenient for you.

Originally Posted by sdpiggylvr

Maybe because they are such tiny animals it seems over-the-top to feed them a whole cup per day.

But have you bothered to look into why it's recommended and why or why not it might be a good idea?

Originally Posted by sdpiggylvr

Rabbits need 2 cups of vegetables per day, but many people don't feed that much because rabbits have been proven to live healthy lives without having veggies.

The actual rule of thumb for rabbits is 2 cups of fresh veggies per 6 lbs of body weight. And I'd also like to know where you're getting your information on rabbits living "healthy lives" without veggies.

Originally Posted by sdpiggylvr

I know the guinea pigs aren't rabbits but it's a similar concept, to me. I do feed them veggies daily, so it's not like I'm doing a "huge disservice" to them. The veggies I feed them amounts to about a cup per pig.

If they are veggies that are too high in calcium, oxalates, or say, Vitamin A or sugars, you are in fact doing them a huge disservice, especially if you are feeding them exactly the same things day in and day out, with no variety to mix up not only their food, but the vitamins and minerals they are getting.

Originally Posted by sdpiggylvr

What I feed my guinea pigs is what I feed my guinea pigs. I'm sorry, but they're just guinea pigs ...

Yeah, they are, and quite honestly, it's this attitude and approach that tends to shorten their lives, allow them to be dumped in shelters or worse, etc. Because where do you draw the line with that attitude - if you won't bother to do research to figure out what's best to feed them because they're just guinea pigs, will you take the time to make them an appropriately sized home, will you take them to the vet when they need to go? After all, they are just guinea pigs.

Originally Posted by sdpiggylvr

and 1 cup of 2-3 veggies as opposed to 1 cup of 4-6 veggies is not going to kill them!

It likely also wouldn't kill them to eat a diet of alfalfa hay and crappy Hartz pellets, but that doesn't mean that's what you should be doing for them. That it "won't kill them" shouldn't be the standard that helps you to determine the life they should live. After all, it wouldn't kill you to eat nothing but McDonalds cheeseburgers and Fritos. But should you? Would you?

Originally Posted by sdpiggylvr

Don't get me wrong, I love guinea pigs and consider them a member of the family but I don't feel the need to feed them a huge salad of several different kinds of veggies.

I don't see how you expect to be taken seriously - at least as far as considering them a part of the family. What other family member do you think, "Oh, that's just my mom, or just my sister, so they don't really need what's best for them"?

Originally Posted by sdpiggylvr

I do feed them about a cup of veggies with 2-4 different kinds and they are perfectly healthy. Period.

I imagine a lot of people have this attitude and approach until one day they're not fine. At which point there's usually no going back.

[Tessa Bea]

About less than a cup being 'okay'... here are my two cents.

As soon as I found out the cup a day rule, I started MEASURING- no more handful of this, a scoop of that, a few of these... I know that a cup a day is best for my pigs, thanks to this forum and Ly's charts. Now that I am informed, I have no excuse or reason to deny them that at all. They depend on me for their care!

I do not see why anyone who is a caring guinea pig owner and 100% responsible for their pigs (meaning they don't depend on other's finances or what have you, such as a parent), after being given the proper information would have any excuse to continue on the same old path of neglect- no matter how 'trivial' or 'okay' they may consider that neglect may be.

[blackarrow]

Originally Posted by sdpiggylvr

Okay, to answer your question about my guinea pigs' diet, Ly&Pigs, I honestly don't know why I feel it's unnecessary. . . . I'm sorry, but they're just guinea pigs and 1 cup of 2-3 veggies as opposed to 1 cup of 4-6 veggies is not going to kill them! . . . . I do feed them about a cup of veggies with 2-4 different kinds and they are perfectly healthy. Period.

All righty then! Why don't you try an experiment. Pick two to four different types of food appropriate for a human. Make them as healthy as you'd like. How about, fish, broccoli, blueberries, oatmeal? Now eat that and nothing more every day for a year and tell me at the end of it how healthy you are - tell me how your energy level is, whether your hair and fingernails are healthy, whether your teeth and bones are strong, whether you've got a healthy level of muscle mass, whether you have more colds, whether you have nutritional deficiencies. It's likely you're not dead, but are you OK? Maybe there's some sort of pesticide residue absorbed by that broccoli, or mercury in that fish, that's of no risk to you if you're eating it twice a week, but when you're eating it each and every day for an entire year, in large quantities because it's nearly your only source of calories, you end up with liver damage. In any case, eating a diet restricted in variety, you're not likely even as OK as you'd be if you occasionally had something that might not be as healthy standing alone - say, pizza - as the other items in your diet.

Same with your pigs.

[distancel]

Originally Posted by sdpiggylvr

I'm sorry, but they're just guinea pigs

Why on earth would you say that on a guinea pig forum? I'm baffled. It is just this kind of attitude towards animals that leads to animal abuse. Because people think they are better, that their needs are more important. It really is quite upsetting.

I had pet rats a few years back and I loved them dearly. I always made sure I was home to feed them and play with them every day. This girl I knew wanted me to go out one night straight after work and I said I had to go home first and see my rats for a while. She said 'What? They're just rats.'

That's when I knew what kind of a person she was. No one has any right at all to think they are better. But sadly so many people have no respect at all for animals.

[sdpiggylvr]

EVERYBODY - Since you all seem to have gotten very angry over this matter, I will feed the varied, 1-cup-per-pig diet. Now will you all stop criticizing me and making me out to be an animal hater? I'm not a complete jerk, ok? I didn't mean to make them sound like little worthless nothings. I love my guinea pigs half to death and I would never abuse them! How can you say such a thing?
Not everybody is the same. Some people have different views and opinions; I'm not saying I think my guinea pigs are worthless, I'm just, well, I don't know what I was trying to say. Maybe I was just trying to find a reason for my opinion.
I don't think I'm better than anybody or anything. Please stop yelling at me. I'm about to cry, this is so hurtful. It makes me feel so bad when you say that, Distancel. I have the utmost respect for animals. Just because I don't think like you doesn't mean I'm a horrible person.
When everybody sort of teams up against me, it doesn't help at all - not to mention hurts my feelings. I mean, this was supposed to be a place for you guys to help other people. I didn't come in here to start a fight and I didn't intend to have you guys jump on me like this. It's not like I'm starving my pigs by not giving them the whatever is recommended diet. They are doing just fine. I agree to change their diet. I started this thread about when people are dissatisfied with the responses to innocent questions they receive ... and now I'm starting to feel like those people. I would have preferred if you guys would have calmly talked to me about this recommended veggie diet instead of jumping on me and judging me like that. I don't care if this is the Kitchen, what you guys have said has not made me feel good. It's only made me feel bad and regret posting this thread. This is the second time I've been jumped on. And quite frankly, I'm getting sick of it! People come on here in need of advice and sometimes the members jump on people and judge them of being horrible people who are intentionally not taking good care of their guinea pigs.
Thanks for your advice, though. I did not appreciate or enjoy being jumped on, critcized, and judged, so please stop. People are supposed to treat people with respect. And when people judge and criticize people, that's not respect.

[sdpiggylvr]

Why don't you try an experiment. Pick two to four different types of food appropriate for a human. Make them as healthy as you'd like. How about, fish, broccoli, blueberries, oatmeal? Now eat that and nothing more every day for a year and tell me at the end of it how healthy you are - tell me how your energy level is, whether your hair and fingernails are healthy, whether your teeth and bones are strong, whether you've got a healthy level of muscle mass, whether you have more colds, whether you have nutritional deficiencies.

I do see your point. I guess I never thought of it that way. I will change their diet. Thanks for opening my eyes. Next time, just be nicer about, please.

[sdpiggylvr]

STOP CRITICIZING ME. I didn't come here to this site to be jumped on, picked apart, and judged! I came here to get advice. If this is what you call advice, then I assure you I will never be asking for advice again. I want to come on here and feel good after leaving, not like I'm a stupid numbskull!
Paula, I am not completely stupid. I know plenty of things about guinea pigs and I bet I could tell you anything about them if you asked. Don't assume I know nothing about guinea pigs when you don't even know me.
Do you guys consider the responses that I'm getting nice? They're far from it - completely disrespectful are the correct words.
Please stop saying such hurtful things to me. I am about to start crying, this is just too much.

[SushiBonzai]

Is it just me, or is it really ironic that a thread titled "Why can't we all get along?" has turned into an argument?

[Ly&Pigs]

Originally Posted by sdpiggylvr

People are supposed to treat people with respect. And when people judge and criticize people, that's not respect.

Like I told you in a private message, respect is earned, not freely given. You have to EARN respect.

No one was judging or criticizing you my dear. We have been trying to get you to provide the "best" life possible for your pigs, not just an "adequate" life.

I rarely issue public warnings, but if your outrageous behavior and temper tantrums do not cease, there will be repercussions. I'm sorry but your latest behavior on this thread will no longer be tolerated. I suggest you calm down and post in a better manner.

You are in a sub-forum of the Kitchen forum. If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen.

[princesspoppy]

No one is jumping on you SD. This isn't a kindergarden where the teachers have to pussy foot around the kids or walk on egg shells. When it comes to the life of a guinea pig or any animal then It's the owners duty to do everything to ensure the animal has a proper roof over it's head,proper diet and proper health. You are taking this way to personal.

[SushiBonzai]

Originally Posted by Ly&Pigs

your outrageous behavior and temper tantrums

I'm sorry to jump it, but it seems to me like she is just defending herself and that everyone is ganging up on her. All the mods often have very valuable advice, but it is true that mods tend to gang up on others.

Sometimes people should just listen to the advice, but I do not believe that anyone deserves to be surrounded with criticism for little things, especially when they are just trying to defend themselves from these attacks.

[Aquena]

Why don't we all stop posting on this thread...cool off and move on.

[sdpiggylvr]

I'm sorry I came across sounding like a temper tantrum. I was merely defending myself because I felt it was inappropriate that everyone was ganging up on me, that's all.
I would have expected that even in the Kitchen, respect would still be given to everybody.
I'm sorry for my outrageous behavior and temper tantrums. I felt pretty upset and I guess I caught up in the heat of the moment. I apologize profusely.

[Ly&Pigs]

Originally Posted by SushiBonzai

I'm sorry to jump it, but it seems to me like she is just defending herself and that everyone is ganging up on her. All the mods often have very valuable advice, but it is true that mods tend to gang up on others.

You can agree or disagree, that is your option. I am not ganging up on her but letting her know that this behavior is not going to be tolerated. She can get her point across in a better way if she needs to.

[SushiBonzai]

Originally Posted by Ly&Pigs

I am not ganging up on her

You may not have been ganging up on her, but others were.

But she's apologized, so I believe we can all move on and talk about others who have not been so mature and have moved onto spamming and AE's. Those are the crazy's I believe this thread was created to talk about.

[princesspoppy]

Spammers and AE's ???

[SushiBonzai]

Yes. Like, when someone comes on and asks a question and hatches, then get corrected and told that hatches are a total no go and they go ballistic and start doing crazy things, ending in getting them banned?

[princesspoppy]

Oh Ok I gotcha.

[blackarrow]

Originally Posted by sdpiggylvr

I'm sorry I came across sounding like a temper tantrum. I was merely defending myself because I felt it was inappropriate that everyone was ganging up on me, that's all.

It's not personal. A number of people disagreed strongly with your opinion, and said so, just as they should have. There is no need to give every side of a point equal time, and it doesn't make it "ganging up" on a member that your point of view was not shared. You said your piece, and everyone else who feels they have something to say, gets to say it. It doesn't make their having spoken up a "gang" action. As far as I know, no one consulted each other and decided to criticize what you said just for the fun of it. I certainly didn't.

Originally Posted by sdpiggylvr

I would have expected that even in the Kitchen, respect would still be given to everybody.

Again, you're confusing respect for someone as a person with respect for their positions. Not all positions are equally valid, and I for one am not about to pretend they are. It doesn't mean I think you're a lousy excuse for a human being or something.

Originally Posted by sdpiggylvr

I'm sorry for my outrageous behavior and temper tantrums. I felt pretty upset and I guess I caught up in the heat of the moment. I apologize profusely.

I appreciate that.