I am building an outdoor guinea pig hutch.

[Seonta]

Originally Posted by silkiepoo

As I was saying, what you said was a little offensive. 'Old standards', and calling us all breeders. Generalisation much. There aren't alot of breeders in England, mainly petshops. Pets-at-home stores are of the upmost quality. If you have actually done your research!

She did not say everyone was a breeder who goes by the old standards. She said that many are. The problem is people look to breeders and see how they house their guinea pigs when they sadly buy guinea pigs instead of adopt. The breeders make the standards because they make their ways most well known. This leads to Petstores who sell guinea pig supplies to sell crap as houses.

I do not understand why you have a problem with people wanting to house and care for their pets under healthy conditions. Read the main page about why bigger cages lead to happier cavies and some of those news links regarding what happens when animals are thrown outside.

A hutch does not protect your animal from coyotes because they are sneaky, cunning, and strong... (not that I am against coyotes- I love all animals). And Racoons are masters at opening things if they want and they are not against eating animals. They can easily kill a defenseless guinea pig or small enough rabbit.

The safest place for a cavy is in your home.

[Richjess]

I don't wish to continue this any further - you will just continue to assert your opinion and say I am wrong, but for one using a show of hands on a forum does not prove a thing - surely you realise that...

You then call me callous, and ignore my reasoning that the healthiest and safest routes are not always the best - there is a logical point at which we all must risk our safety, there is no such thing as a totally safe existence and safety outdoors is completely relative to each of us (a point which you totally ignored), and again the quality of life issue is an opinion - I said it was mine and others, I was never so insulting as to cast judgement on those who actually do it

You then proceed to compare me to someone who is hard-headed about neutering - which of course I am not, and which of course is a much easier argument for you to destroy...that would be a strawman and is a truly awful way of arguing

You also mention the advice I gave - I retracted that 3 posts ago and apologised, it was bad, unthoughtful advice - it was rightly criticised and retracted, it is your assumption that it is somehow a totally wrong practice that I take issue with - it is your way, fine, I am not the one saying what is right and wrong

I will leave this debate knowing that you disapprove of my actions, and frankly, not caring, in the same way that you do not care for my views, you will no doubt regard me as an ignorant fool, and that's fine, because you can think whatever you want, and so can I

good day

[Pulsepoint129]

Originally Posted by CavyMama

Racist??? I fail to see where you are getting that. Which "race" are you referring to, exactly?

Just a guess, but I'm thinking that poster means more "ethnocentric" than racist?

[CavyMama]

Originally Posted by Pulsepoint129

Just a guess, but I'm thinking that poster means more "ethnocentric" than racist?

I'm guessing you are right but I was questioning their use of the word "racist" as you don't want to bandy that word around lightly and there was no racial issue in question. Strong feelings are associated with the word "racist" and it's irresponsible to toss it about as if it's a cover-all for any group.

[sealion]

Mariaelise, what do you want us to tell you ? That its okay to keep guinea pigs outdoors, that they are going to be so happy ? Or maybe you posted here knowing you wouldn't have positive feedback but just wanted to create some drama ?
If you love your guinea pigs as much as you claim so, then please, give them a nice indoor cage (2X4) with a nice bedding, food...and especially what they wouldn't have outside : human interaction.
Of course guinea pigs can live outdoors. Humans can live outdoors too you know. But it's not what's best for our health and happiness (unless it's what you chose to do).
Maybe you could let your guinea pigs outside for floor time a couple hours a day in a safe pen.

[DaCourt]

Originally Posted by rabbitsncavyluv

You were asked to give the name of your vet and you haven't. If he is so great then surely we must have heard of him. Is he on Cavy Haven's vet list?

I don't think she has a vet. If he/she was so wonderful, you would think she would want to share with the rest of us.

And as a So Cal resident, I am really interested in finding out where this town is that has no crime.

[Jessskater1]

All my guinea pigs live outside. Just because they are outside dosen't disclude from the family. In fact in case u already didn't know guinea pigs come from peru where the days are hot and the nights are fairly cold. So my point is that your guinea pigs can live outside and be way more happy to breath in the fresh air than be in a house.

[CavyMama]

Originally Posted by Jessskater1

All my guinea pigs live outside. Just because they are outside dosen't disclude from the family. In fact in case u already didn't know guinea pigs come from peru where the days are hot and the nights are fairly cold. So my point is that your guinea pigs can live outside and be way more happy to breath in the fresh air than be in a house.

Those pigs in Peru also lived outside in nature where they could use their natural instincts to hide from predators. In a hutch outside, they are in the open where predators can not only find them but get at them fairly easily. They are basically sitting ducks, or fish in a barrel.

Those pigs in Peru could also find a warm place to nest when it got cold at night. The pigs in an outdoor hutch are limited as to where they can get a warm enough spot to sleep.

Wild Peruvian pigs that could use their instincts to find food and shelter were far different than the domesticated guinea pigs of today who rely on people to provide for their needs. A guinea pig in the backyard is out of sight, out of mind and their level of care is determined by how much or how little motivation their human has to actually go outside on hot days and cold nights to take care of them.

Keeping them inside is the far better option for any number of reasons, all of which have been listed here in this thread so it's rather like beating a dead horse at this point. Don't you think?

[Jennicat]

Using the excuse that their wild ancestors survived the weather is like refusing to feed your dog because (after all) he came from wolves, so he should be able to take a deer down on his own, right?

[VoodooJoint]

Let's not forget that wild guinea pigs (which hardly resemble our domesticated ones) only have a lifespan of about a year, usually less. They die off quickly due to injury, illness and predation. Thus, why they are able to reproduce so young, so often and why they have babies that are born "running"

But HEY! As long as it's "natural" it MUST be good.

[pigsmakemesmile]

Originally Posted by Jessskater1

All my guinea pigs live outside. Just because they are outside dosen't disclude from the family. In fact in case u already didn't know guinea pigs come from peru where the days are hot and the nights are fairly cold. So my point is that your guinea pigs can live outside and be way more happy to breath in the fresh air than be in a house.

Because their Ancestry is to the Peruvians doesn't qualify "domesticated" cavies to outdoor life. And as for location, there is a sharp temperature difference between Peru to your location in Canada were it's quite colder to say the least. I cannot for the life of me imagine how cold your pigs are and literally suffer during the winter months in Canada were the arctic air is so much harsher simply because of your mindset. I find it very "Cruel" for you to house them outdoors just for this reason alone. You really need to re-think your logic for the sake of the animals. Domesticated is just that...they are domesticated towards being accustomed to being cared for..meaning, being fed, being kept warm, being kept safe, things that if they were raised in the wild, they'd learn on their own, but in captivity, this opportuinity for learning is taken from them.

[rabbitsncavyluv]

Originally Posted by Jessskater1

All my guinea pigs live outside. Just because they are outside dosen't disclude from the family. In fact in case u already didn't know guinea pigs come from peru where the days are hot and the nights are fairly cold. So my point is that your guinea pigs can live outside and be way more happy to breath in the fresh air than be in a house.

If it is so nice outdoors why don't you move outside permanently with your pigs then?

[silkiepoo]

Originally Posted by rabbitsncavyluv

You're funny. I have heard terrible stories about Pets At Home - and where do you think pet stores get their animals? gasp ... breeders?!

So there must be breeders if they are selling animals and you have pet guinea pigs. And isn't showing/breeding big in the UK?

OH SHOCK, OH GASP! Guess where rescues get their cavies? BREEDERS.
And if not, where do you think the people before the rescue got them, BREEDERS.

[Amiee]

Originally Posted by pigsmakemesmile

Because their Ancestry is to the Peruvians doesn't qualify "domesticated" cavies to outdoor life. And as for location, there is a sharp temperature difference between Peru to your location in Canada were it's quite colder to say the least. I cannot for the life of me imagine how cold your pigs are and literally suffer during the winter months in Canada were the arctic air is so much harsher simply because of your mindset.

Um... generalizing about the climate in Canada is not usually a good idea. I'm not justifying keeping guinea pigs outside, just saying it may not be as cold as you think, you really don't know. It depends on where he/she is in BC - southern BC has quite a mild climate compared to the rest of Canada (generally speaking ).

Originally Posted by rabbitsncavyluv

If it is so nice outdoors why don't you move outside permanently with your pigs then?

Good advice - if it's too cold for you without specialized cold-weather gear, it's probably too cold for your pigs who don't have cold-weather gear. If you're comfy and feel safe to stay out there forever, well, that's one thing. Or you could just stay there and let the pigs have your room!

[blackarrow]

Originally Posted by Amiee

[S]outhern BC has quite a mild climate compared to the rest of Canada (generally speaking ).

That's nice, but that some parts of Canada aren't as cold as others doesn't say anything about ANY part of Canada being warm enough for guinea pigs to live outdoors. I live in upstate NY, which is further south than about 98% of Canada, and can say with some confidence that IT ISN'T SUITABLE.

[blackarrow]

Originally Posted by silkiepoo

OH SHOCK, OH GASP!. . . .
And if not, where do you think the people before the rescue got them, BREEDERS.

Yes, and that's a problem. That's the point.

The number of pigs that are the accidental offspring of missexed pet shop pigs or of pigs housed together by people who don't know they're already sexually mature is quite sufficient to keep rescues busy without breeders adding to the mess.

[Amiee]

Originally Posted by blackarrow

That's nice, but that some parts of Canada aren't as cold as others doesn't say anything about ANY part of Canada being warm enough for guinea pigs to live outdoors. I live in upstate NY, which is further south than about 98% of Canada, and can say with some confidence that IT ISN'T SUITABLE.

Did you read to the end of the post where I agreed with others that if it's so nice and warm outside that the human should live out there instead of the pigs? I never said it was warm enough for pigs, I was arguing what was said about the Arctic winds, which makes it sound much worse than it may be.

Oh, and latitude isn't everything - just compare England and Canada for latitude and climate. The west coast is a totally different story climate-wise than the east coast.

[Wodentoad]

Originally Posted by blackarrow

That's nice, but that some parts of Canada aren't as cold as others doesn't say anything about ANY part of Canada being warm enough for guinea pigs to live outdoors. I live in upstate NY, which is further south than about 98% of Canada, and can say with some confidence that IT ISN'T SUITABLE.

Agreed, and as a further point, I live in Tennessee. Now, we don't get snow every year where I live, but there are weeks when I cover every available inch of skin to keep warm and I avoid going out at all. OUR winters are not suitable for guinea pigs, nor are our summers. Mosquitoes are terrible this year, and it's been hot as blazes. DOMESTIC pigs are temperature sensitive. What does that tell you about Canada far to my north? If a person can freeze to death outside, my animals aren't staying.

At the moment, my boys are playing tag and running laps around their indoor cage and clowning up a storm. I can't imagine missing a second of this--they had me laughing in tears yesterday from the pure, unadulterated adorableness. How much would I have missed had I banished them to the cold, predator-filled outdoors?

Yay, warm snuggles! Yay, happy piggies.

[Amiee]

I agree that guinea pigs should not be kept outside! For a variety of reasons! I'm just trying to say all of Canada is not a frozen wasteland, and latitude is not all that determines climate.

[blackarrow]

Originally Posted by Amiee

Did you read to the end of the post where I agreed with others that if it's so nice and warm outside that the human should live out there instead of the pigs? I never said it was warm enough for pigs, I was arguing what was said about the Arctic winds, which makes it sound much worse than it may be.

Yes, I did read your whole post, and I can't imagine why you think there is any part of Canada which doesn't experience Arctic winds. It's a simple geographical fact. And who cares if it "sounds much worse" than it is, when what it is, is TOTALLY UNSUITABLE for outdoor habitation?

No kidding latitude doesn't mean everything, but England = also unsuitable. You're not helping yourself here.