When will this cruelty stop?

[mncavylover]

Sparky, have you really read my post? How is hunting a waste of resources?

[DocDolittle]

MN, trophy hunting is really just using the fur/antlers/ivory or other completely superficial items from the animal and disposing of the meat(i.e. 'wasting' it)

[mncavylover]

Ahhh... thanks, Doc. *grins stupidly* Sorry about that. I thought Sparky meant bullets or something. Wow am I slow today!

[DocDolittle]

Not a problem.

[Sparky]

these are my opinions, i'm not forcing them on you, i realize this is mostly a vegetarian site, but please, i dont feel there is anything inherently wrong with dissections, please leave me be

[RubyPiggie2]

Originally Posted by Access

Dominion or control over animals, that's an illusion. On a whole we are dependent on animals much more than they are dependent on us. We depend on animals as a food source, as a labor source, or for specific tasks (laboratory testing, sight/smell, etc.) Superiority is a man-made idea. Many pets are 'in control' of their owners, not the other way around.

I never thought about it that way(I know, that's bad), but now that I do, you are absolutely correct about that.

[RubyPiggie2]

Originally Posted by Sparky

these are my opinions, i'm not forcing them on you, i realize this is mostly a vegetarian site, but please, i dont feel there is anything inherently wrong with dissections, please leave me be

First of all, you don't think there is anything wrong if they kill the animal for dissection?
And secondly, if you want us to leave you be, stop coming onto the kitchen forum. Remember, it's "If you can't stand the heat, stay out of the Kitchen." Apparently, you can't stand the heat.

[mncavylover]

Sparky, I understand that everyone is entitled to their own opinions. Heck, someone can be pro-child abuse, right? However, does that make it legal for them to lead their lives in such a manner as to put children in danger, simply because of their own opinions? If you have a bit of time, please do look at one or more the following links. Perhaps it will show you some of the issues raised with dissection.

http://www.peta.org/mc/FactsheetDisplay.asp?ID=92
http://www.animalliberation.org.au/dissectarg.html (Please note: this one has a graphic image of an animal).
http://www.navs.org/education/pdf/collegebooklet.pdf

[VoodooJoint]

As far as I see it dissection in a high school or lower education levels is a waste of life, money and time. There is nothing a child in those levels can learn from cutting up a once living animal that they can’t learn from a book or the internet. After all how many of us that had to do dissection in high school can still correctly label the Anterior adductor muscle or the Umbo of a clam? How about remembering how to differentiate between the male and female reproductive parts of an earthworm? If I put an opened frog in front of you how long would it take you to find the Gall Bladder? Most people will go into work fields where they will never need that information therefore it is a waste of animal life.

The only time dissection becomes important, even necessary, is at college level and then only if it is in preparation of the student going into a medical field.

[LiciaMommycott]

The Humane Society has some good articles about dissection:


http://www.hsus.org/press_and_publications/press_releases/back_to_school_shouldnt_mean_back_to_dissection_sa ys_the_hsus.html

[miskaffon]

Please understand I am trying to bring some sense of possible motives to bear in this heated discussion. I saw no reference as to what was going on with this picture as it appears on the website. The name seems to be associated with a veterinary school (?)

Could it have been a necropsy photograph? Wouldn't you want to know what had happened to your pig if it died and you couldn't figure out the reason?

I'm not trying to say that this photo was a case of necropsy, but what if it was? Bashing the "researchers" for their job would be taking away the hard-to-find medical information that many on this forum desire for their well-loved pets.

I don't really like dissection and necropsy either, but I see it as a necessary evil to understand the possible health care issues surrounding our beloved family members.

[Quiet Things]

Hi all.

Its a dissection yeah? As nasty as it looks its necessary. I had a litter of babies that all became ill with something the vet couldnt figure out. We allowed her to use the body of the worst affected (who was put down) for research. That means, yes, she dissected it, and being a pet I loved it making this a personal thing. I know its not a nice thing to think about or to look at. But it is necessary, without it no one would ever be able to help the beautiful creatures of the world.

If people have no idea what an animal is like on the inside how can they help to treat them if they become ill? I realise that the killing of an animal for research doesn;t sound humane but when you really get down to it, it is. It stops a lot of suffering.

I don't know all that much on the topic, and I know that discredits my argument. But in my eyes it is not cruelty, the animal is dead, it is usually killed humanely and it is for the greater good. This is one case I believe the end can justify the means.

[lindsey's boys]

I never really thought like it that way.

[VoodooJoint]

Quiet Things

What you are describing is a necropsy. A Necropsy is like an autopsy. It’s the dissection of an animal that has died to learn why/how it died and to learn more about what it died of.

In a dissection (such as for a classroom) a healthy animal is killed to dissect it to learn about what a healthy animal’s internal organs look like.

Necropsies are good things. Dissection, like I said earlier (scroll up to post #69), is a waste of life and time. Unless it is done at an education level of college or above and the person doing the dissection is going into a medical field of some sort.

[DocDolittle]

Yep, everything I would have said was just pointed out in Voodoojoint's post. Often times pet owners get necropsies done on their pets to discover what was wrong with it/see if it was contagious and if they should be concerned about another pet. This is not a waste of life, because the animal would have died anyway. My belief is, this is in every way perfectly fine. However, I think that unless the dissection was for veterinary or medical school, it's a waste of life. And even with those exceptions, I hate the idea with all of the realistic computer programs out there.

[miskaffon]

Again, can anyone elaborate on what this photo was documenting? Was it a necropsy or dissection? For the purpose of elementary/jr/sr high school science? Or was it for a University-level class?

Lots of questions, many assumptions made on this board as to what the organization that posted the photo was doing.

In primary school level science, there is no reason to use dissection. I cannot imagine anyone who could claim that it was necessary. For University-level courses, maybe it is appropriate in some cases.

Necropsy, however, is another issue. When a sick animal does not present normal or any symptoms and dies a necropsy (however sad and unwanted) is one of the only ways to answer what might have happened.

I would be very interested in finding out what the purpose of the picture was.

[Quiet Things]

Voodoojoint

Thanks for specifying. I wasn't aware there was really that much difference. From experience I must also add that where I went to school (in Australia) we didn't actually disect animals just parts that can be eaten and parts that can't, such as lungs. Actually can you eat lungs? yuck. Also I believe it is not just sick animals that are killed and researched but also healthy animals to find out how they work. Is this also classified as necropsy?