Cavy & Dog

[dagwellismypigy]

I actually wouldnt mind. I like being an only child and classrooms would be a lot less crowded *SARCASM!!*

[VoodooJoint]

In reply to phantac, Snipzig and Krysanthemum

Originally Posted by phantac

You can give your opinion Voodoo but I wouldnt give an order. Why dont you ask her why she opts for pups again first?

phantac - As far as I can tell you have been extremely unhelpful on a board that advocates spaying/neutering and animal welfare...I wonder why you are here.

My feelings on breeding animals in a world choked with unwanted animals is strong. Therefore my opinion is strong. If you don’t like it that is your problem, not mine.

I considered asking why she wants the pups but realized that none of the reasons I would hear would be good enough. As far as I can tell from that picture that is up the dog is not a supreme representative of it’s breed. I doubt it is an agility champ, obedience champ, certified assistance dog or anything more then a cute family pet.

I decided not to "pussyfoot" around and simply state what I felt. The dog should not be bred. Doing so is irresponsible and selfish.

Originally Posted by Snipzig

We have bred her 2 times before and all of the puppies went with interviewed people to make sure they are fine.

Oh how lovely! How many dogs do you have in your rescue? After all if you breed you had better be rescuing. Otherwise you are simply making more work for those of us trying to help all of the unwanted, neglected and abused animals out there.

How many of the puppies leave your home spayed, neutered and with health certificates? If those pups aren’t altered then how many of the people you sell puppies to are going to breed their dogs? How many of the resulting dogs will be bred? I think I know the answer to my own questions and all I can do is thank you for making my job harder.

Are you ready to take back all of the dogs you have bred? Let me guess...none will come back to you because they all went to good homes. Guess again. What one day is deemed a good home can become a home where "we are moving", "having a baby", "don’t have time", "can’t afford the vet bills" and the dog is tossed out. I see it every day. The excuses are pathetic and the irresponsible breeders are even more pathetic.

My words are harsh, I know. No one needs to tell me. Ask anyone here. I’m not out to make friends, I have enough friends. I tell it like it is. Not how I think it is...LIKE IT IS!

Originally Posted by Krysanthemum

/sarcasm on

I know, let's just stop all animals everywhere from breeding. We can spay them all, and then we definitely won't have an animal overpopulation problem!

Try not to say ridiculous things. It only makes you look ridiculous too. If you honestly believe that all breeding will stop and wipe out animals then you are a fool. As long as people like Snipzig are around breeding will never stop.

Originally Posted by Krysanthemum

I know, even better. There's also a human overpopulation problem. There's a large percentage of the world that doesn't even have enough food and water! We should stop humans from breeding. Spay all teenagers now!

That’s a human rights issue. Animals, like it or not, are property. Take that argument to a more appropriate board. Yes, yes, I know you were making a point...bad comparison though and ridiculous.

Originally Posted by Krysanthemum

And anyway, who are you to tell her dog that she's not allowed to breed?

As far as I can tell none of my altered animals seem the least bit upset that they can’t breed. You are being ridiculous again.

Originally Posted by Krysanthemum

I'm sick of the attitude on this board that any differing opinion is wrong, wrong, wrong.

Then go to a board where they condone breeding. I’m not going to stop being a "big mouth" on the subject and I hope the others here that feel the same keep speaking out too.

[tashagurl]

There are plenty of poodle rescues. See, http://www.petfinder.org/shelters/SC11.html, I found one and I wasent even looking very hard.

Take a trip to your local animal shelter and make your potential puppy parents go with you. If you guys can look at all those beutiful dogs who will die if they dont find a home in a certain amount of time and you still want to breed your dog for a THIRD time and they still want the puppies, something is seriously wrong with you.



Dogs and cavies can get along., but I wouldnt trust my dogs alone with one. My golden has tried to get them to play with him before and if I hadent been watching my pig might have gotten hurt. He is a very gental dog and he wasent trying to hurt the pig, but he could have just the same.

[phantac]

phantac - As far as I can tell you have been extremely unhelpful on a board that advocates spaying/neutering and animal welfare...I wonder why you are here.

You know Voodoo.......You and others like you here are so narrow minded that you dont even read what people write. . I am all for neutering. I have always had my pets neutered/spayed. I have worked for shelters in my younger years.

If you read what I wrote you would see all I was talking about was the way people here communicate their opinions to those they disagree with. All I said was if you want to educate people and sway them to your side you should give your opinion in a nicer fashion and maybe then you can keep comunication open and you can then persuade them to see your side of it. THATS ALL I WROTE.

Evidently you and others like you enjoy bullying others around with your "orders"....opinions as you say and if you and your others feel good about the way you conduct yourselves then continue as you do.

I have taken in more strays and have devoted much of my time to homeless animals in my lifetime than you will ever know.

If you and many others really cared about this forum you would care about the way people are treated here. Just go back and read ALL THOSE POSTS telling you how NASTY, RUDE, CONDENSENDING you all are. So its not just me, but many many others who feel the same as me. I am sure there are many more who just wont say anything because they want to stay on your good side.

If you continue to ignore this then eventually you wont have a forum to go to.

By the way, I agree with you and all the others on your views, just to set the record straight, its just the way you convey them that I dont agree with.

[VoodooJoint]

Originally Posted by phantac

You know Voodoo.......You and others like you here are so narrow minded that you dont even read what people write.... All I said was if you want to educate people and sway them to your side you should give your opinion in a nicer fashion and maybe then you can keep comunication open

Phantac - You are right. You haven’t been unhelpful. I’ve had you confused withkatrina, the girl that was nearly banned.
I don’t try to be mean. I didn’t feel I was being mean in my first post. You took my one line, "Spay her now and stop contributing to the animal overpopulation problem" and decided to make a big deal over it. As I said at the end of that post, "enough said". That is all I meant to post. However, you decided to take my bluntness and call me "hostile".

You called me narrow-minded...yes, I guess I am. You see I am unwilling and unable to think that irresponsible and/or cruel behavior is okay sometimes or under certain circumstances.

I don’t think it’s okay to physically abuse an animal sometimes. I don’t think it’s okay to starve an animal sometimes. I don’t think it’s okay to breed an animal that has no business being bred sometimes.

If I’m blunt it’s because I’m sick and tired of explaining it over and over again. I was hoping that my one line post would inspire others to take over the job...and people did! Thank you to all of those that took the time to explain the whys in kinder detailed wording!

I wonder Phantac why you didn't help explain why breeding at this time is wrong...you spent far more time arguing with me then trying to help educate.
If it helps you can pretend it’s a game of "Good Cop, Bad Cop". Guess which one I want to play.

[pennick]

Lets just call it a truce since we are all here for the same thing. We just all have different views on how to handle it. We all love animals and we just want to see to the welfare of them. We all get carried away sometimes or over-react, so be it, we are only human.

[suzy_99]

I am starting to get a little frustrated by people always saying to go to shelters know matter what. The fact is that some people do not even have shelters near them. I am beginning to feel like a terrible person because my animals did not come from shelters (got one of my cats from a litter that a stray had, but that's it) We have two shelters here, but none of them have dogs (or exotics) and they haven't had any for a quite a long time and I am quite positive that I would have to drive for about 10 hours or more to find a purebreed dog shelter. People on this forum who are from big cities or who are relatively close to them do not seem to understand what life is like in rural canada where I live. I cannot even get shampoo for my guinea pigs, because it is not carried around here. We do not even have an exotic vet, although mine has done extra research for me. I also find it very hard to drive for 3 hours to adopt a puppy and then have to pay $200 for it...I just can't afford this type of money. I have three dogs now. Two we got from a couple who lives near me and the other I rescued from a pet store that I was working at years ago (she had been dropped off all alone by someone who did not want her) and I do not beleive that I am a bad person for getting my animals in this way, but that fact is that I really had no other choice and maybe you should start thinking of the fact that some other people out there might also not have the option to go to a shelter before you start tearing them apart. I haven't even been attacked in this way yet and it makes me feel terrible about myself, so just imagine what it is doing to the people that the comments are directed towards.

In my own defence, I would like to say that if a person has access to a shelter, there is no reason to get an animal anywheres else and I know that if I ever get another cat, I will get her from the shelter we do have around here (they have lots of cats, but that's all).
Sorry if I came off a little rude or offensive, this was not my intention.

[Snipzig]

May I say something?My dog cocoa just recently adopted her stuffed scooby toy,she takes it to bed , protects him from us,and tries to get him to nurse.If there is a puppy crying on TV she whimpers and looks around.We are not breeding for purity,money,or business.We just breed her because she loves puppies and If we didn't breed them they would eventually die out.One of the people on the list is my riding instructor's mother and her poodle had just died so we gave her one of cocoa's puppies from the first litter,the next time cocoa gives birth she is taking in anothr puppy for a friend.If you ask me some of you are being VERY rude.

[Katie]

As long as you are not supporting puppymills and backyard breeders, I don't have any problems with people not going to shelters. There are many other ways of obtaining animals, such as private parties, these forums, newspapers, veterinary offices, and strays.

Shelters are everywhere, as are purebred rescues, you just have to know where to look. I don't live in a big city. I live in a "village."

Not all shelters and rescues charge $200. Most charge between $10-$90. The purebred rescues charge more because 1.) They are purebred dogs 2.) They are fully vaccinated, neutered, UTD on Heartworm and fleas preventative.

If you can't find or afford a purebred dog from a shelter or rescue, you won't be able to find or afford one from a reputable breeder.

Where there are animals, there are shelters, period. If you can open your newspaper and see puppies and kittens listed, there are shelters.

I myself did not adopt any dogs from shelters. All of ours were found as strays, same with our cats. 8 years ago I bought guinea pigs from pet stores. I thought the same thing "there are no shelters." Boy was I wrong! There are 5 guinea pig rescues in my area, not including mine. Two are right here in my "village" and 3 are in the next town over.

[Katie]

Originally Posted by Snipzig

May I say something?My dog cocoa just recently adopted her stuffed scooby toy,she takes it to bed , protects him from us,and tries to get him to nurse.If there is a puppy crying on TV she whimpers and looks around.We are not breeding for purity,money,or business.We just breed her because she loves puppies and If we didn't breed them they would eventually die out.One of the people on the list is my riding instructor's mother and her poodle had just died so we gave her one of cocoa's puppies from the first litter,the next time cocoa gives birth she is taking in anothr puppy for a friend.If you ask me some of you are being VERY rude.

That is the WORST reason to breed. There are millions of purebred and mixed breed dogs dying each and every year! You are nothing but a selfish backyard breeder. Get your dog spayed! PERIOD! Leave the breeding to the reputable breeders that KNOW what they are doing. The breed will not die out, .

[VoodooJoint]

Suzy_99

I’m pretty sure from your post that you have the best of intentions. While you may not be able to rescue all of your pets it sounds as if you do the best you can. Your best is all anyone can ask of you.

It sounds like you are educated about the animal overpopulation problem. I have a feeling that you have never, purposely, bred one of your animals.

Just because you may fit into some general category does not mean you are part of the problem. Just accept the fact that rescuing, not breeding or buying, is best and help others get into the same mind-set. That way you are prepared to go the extra mile to save an animal instead of the convenience of buying one. If you have exhausted all reasonable options to adopt and had to buy I don’t think anyone, not even mean old me, would fault you.

[suzy_99]

I have never breed any of my animals and they are all fixed (except the guineas, but there all female), because we do not want to bring more animals into this world when so many are unwanted, plus I would never be able to give them away.

Katie,

You are lucky enough to live in a village where there are shelters that will adopt out all kinds of animals for a resonable price, but I am not this lucky. We were going to have our first spca shelter, but guess what, it was burned down by arsonist.
I have recently tried to adopt another guinea pig, but the closest one that I found was in the province of Prince Edward Island and this would be a very very long drive for me. I am sorry to sound rude, but I am very involved in animals welfare groups in my community and I know for a fact that if someone wanted to adopt a dog they may have to wait for up to a year. The reason that the adoption prices are so high is because all of the animals are have microchips and all have been spayed or neutured and because our shelter does not even have its own building, it must rely on foster homes for its cats and I am also involved in this.
We really do not have a big problem with animal overpopulation in my town. There are rarely dog or cat advertisements in our paper unless they are for purebreeds, so I guess this is why we have never really even come close to having a real shelter until now.

[VoodooJoint]

Here’s a story I would like to share about a couple of my dogs.

A woman bred her Great Dane. Her reasons? To make a little money and because she could. Her female was a Merle...similar in genetic make-up to a dalmatian Guinea Pig. Merles carry a lethal gene and should never be bred. The dog had 13 pups 3 died for "unknown reasons"...my guess they were lethals. The rest were weaned too young, sold unaltered and once weaned were fed crappy, cheap food. Apparently whatever they were eating was so inadequate that they were skinny, smelly and lethargic for puppies. They even had toenails that were white. My vet thought I had painted their toenails with Whiteout. We never did figure out what dietary or internal problem caused their toenails to be pure, opaque white like that.

I showed up at this woman’s house, picked out two dogs and said "I’m taking these two". She said "Great, that will be $500.00."I informed her that she misunderstood me. I was taking the dogs and giving her no money at all. When she argued I pointed out that she had 10 pups and had only sold one. Her ad had run for two weeks with no interest. If she let me walk away with 2 pups she would know at least 2 got a good home. She finally agreed and I left with my 2 rescued pups after trying to educate her on why she should no longer breed.

The woman only managed to sell 2 more pups. The other 5 ended up dumped at a shelter. Giant breed dogs often do not find homes. They were most likely killed. Of course, knowing what I know now, I’m certain they are better off dead.

As time went by with the two (named Stanley and Stella) I managed to rescue the problems I was dreading started to arise.

-by 1 year of age both Danes were diagnosed with Hip Dysplacia. Much worse in the male Dane.

-by 2 Stanley was diagnosed with a Thyroid problem for which he required medication 2 times a day. He also developed "Hot Spots" an often genetic skin condition.

Stella was diagnosed with severe allergies to just about everything and needed to be put on a special diet the rest of her life. Later that year she got Gastric Dilatation Volvulous (Bloat) and required immediate emergency surgery to save her life. Thousands of dollars in surgery and treatment later she managed to survive against all odds.

-by 3 Stanley was nearly crippled by his Hip Dysplacia and was not a good candidate for hip replacement.

-by 4 Stanley was dead. His liver failed and may also have been in heart failure. We chose to end his short, tragic life instead of trying to keep him alive...or more appropriately prolong his death.

- Stella, Stan’s sister, is now 6. She is starting to have problems walking too. I wonder how long she will stay with me. I doubt if we have more then 1-2 more years together.

I often wonder about the other pups in that litter. Chances are they all have the same problems as Stan and Stella. Did their owners take as good of care of their dogs as I did? Chances are they didn’t.

All of this stemmed from someone who bred their dog not for purity or to better the breed. They didn’t bother tracing the dog’s bloodline or getting health tests. They bred because they could. They created lives without a single thought of care about what they were doing or why.

My 2 dogs I got for free have cost more then $10.000 in vet bills alone. I don’t even want to try to add up what their special dietary needs and supplements have cost.

Please, please, please, I’m begging. Stop breeding. Every litter creates more of a chance of disaster. Every litter adds more dogs that will breed.

I wish I still had that back yard breeders number. I would have liked for her to explain to my son, who was 5 at the time, why his best friend died. The friend that taught him to walk by lowering his big head so my son could grab his lips and stand up. The friend that gave "horsie rides" when my son was 1. The friend that allowed my kids to use him as a big warm pillow when they watched T,V,. The friend that at 287 pounds would curl himself up into an amazingly small ball so as not to crowd my son in his bed.

If breeding must happen please leave it to the reputable breeders that know their dog’s bloodline. The ones that truly do want to improve the breed. The ones that spay and neuter the pet quality pups and place the "breeding quality" pups into homes with other people that know how important health, temperament and breed quality is.

[RubyPiggie2]

Wonderful story voodoo. One of the many reasons not to breed. I'm terribly sorry for your loss.

Man, I don't get on for a few days and look at all the goodies. This thread even moved to the Kitchen forum.
Does Snipzig still intend to breed? Or is Snipzig understanding what we're talking about?

[tashagurl]

My mom thought about breeding our yorkie mix because she loves puppies too. She eventually decided against it.Leilani doesnt have a huge hole in her life because she has never had puppies of her own. She snuggles with my guinea pigs and she raised one of our cats.