Lethal guinea pigs discussion

[salana]

However I have a black guinea pig with brown flecks, sort of like spots but not. I was wondering if that means she is possibly roan/dal?

No. Mixed black and red hairs are brindling, not roaning. There's no genetic problems with brindling as far as I know.

I'm sure there are many people who thought the same thing & ended up with a litter (& probably lethals too.)

That's how I got Einstein. The pet store did separate their males and females, but Suzi was probably already pregnant when she got there.

[Erin8607]

Our rescue just welcomed a litter of babies from a sow that came to our rescue 68 days ago with her brother, and two other guinea pigs from the same mother, different litter.

Opal is a really poorly marked roan, and was housed with her beautiful tri-roan brother Max. Obviously, this meant trouble for the upcoming babies. Opal delivered three babies today, 2 roans of which one was stillborn and 1 lethal. How do we know he's a lethal? His teeth were the giveaway.

For now, the lethal seems to be doing well. Active and alert. We'll do our best at a daily journal as he grows up - I'll have his foster mom start it for now until he returns back here to the rescue and my care. We're planning for now to keep him in our sanctuary so he's guarenteed to get the medical care he needs. If we ever feel it would be ok to do so and his medical needs aren't too extensive, he will be offered up for adoption to a seriously special home.

Here are some photos:
Opal, the mother



Max, the father


Patrick, the lethal baby & his teeth




Gary, the other surviving baby's teeth for comparison

[mom to cujo]

My heart just breaks for the poor baby. He is so lucky to have someone knowledgable to take care of him. I pray that there aren't a bunch of hidden problems and that he never has to suffer. My toughts and prayers are with both of you.

[Love_my_piggies]

Oh my goodness, how sad. Bless you for caring for this sweet baby and I wish you all the luck. As mom to cujo said, My thoughts and prayers are also with you.

[Ly&Pigs]

I want cyber-dibs on Patrick. Besides that is my son's middle name! He is so lucky to have you and his foster mom taking wonderful care of him.

[Quiet Things]

I bet Patrick is super lucky to have someone willing to do all they can for him. My thoughts are with you both and I hope it's only his teeth that are the problem.

[ChelesGP]

Hello everyone, I'm Patrick's foster mom.

Patrick is doing great! He is eating hay and pellets. Also, he LOVES critical care mixed with sweet potato baby food. His weight had gone down 15 grams, at birth he was 135 grams. As of this morning, he is back up to 135 grams. He does everything his brother does, except Patrick runs into the side of his pigloo from time to time.

Patrick has been to our (Erin and mine) regular vet, where she confirmed he is blind and deaf. He has an appointment at Barberton Exotic Speciality Hospital on Monday. Our normal vet didn't have equipment small enough to look at his molars, which is why he's going to the speciality hospital.

Patrick is a very special and loving pig. Erin and I both love him so much.

[salana]

Does anyone know of a) any scientific studies performed on lethal white pigs at all, and/or b) any results of necropsies of lethals, particularly lethals that died shortly after birth?

I've been researching similar disorders in other animals, many of which are called "lethal white", and the ones most similar to lethal white cavies are anophthalmic white Syrian hamsters and microphthalmic mice. These involve a mutation of the gene for the Mitf protein, which does some things related to embryonic development. The thing is, in mice, hamsters, and humans, there are several different known mutations of the gene, some of which have stronger effects than others. This could partially explain why some lethals are better off than others, and why some die within days of birth. Einstein might have a mutation that severely interferes with tooth development, Patrick's gene might cause only a mild problem that lets him have some front teeth and less messed-up molars, and there's a lethal in Arizona that seems to have perfect teeth. Three different geographic areas...three different mutations?

It's so annoying that geneticists never seem to use guinea pigs. I mean, they're guinea pigs! They're the epitome of the research animal! I for one would be delighted if someone was running a study and wanted samples of Einstein's blood to figure out what was going on with him genetically.

[Erin8607]

I believe that the Gainsville Guinea Pig Rescue still has a lethal now in sanctuary after they recently closed their doors. Perhaps email them about the severity of his problems? I think he may be a couple years old, too.

You could also email ChadWPB and see if he has more information or a contact person.

I actually thought of contacting her about the possibility of taking him in as a companion for Patrick, but I'm not in a position to do so right now so I don't want to get the ball rolling just yet. If, in fact, she would even consider it. I wouldn't mind doing for two as long as I am doing for one. But I have other pigs that need to get adopted beforehand, and I'm not sure the blind(if her pig is blind) leading the blind is wise! If Patrick doesn't stay with his brother, he'll probably get one of my spayed sows as a mentor.

[salana]

I know Sullivan has two incisors, his molars are fine, he's blind and missing one eye, and is not deaf. His head tilts towards the missing eye.

Blind pigs seem to make great leaders, but they can't follow!

[Erin8607]

Do you have any idea how old he is? How old is Claude, the guy Chii has?

There are some breeder posts I've read, the rare breeder that keeps the lethals they breed for whatever reason - they seem to think they only live about 18 months on average. Einy is over 2 now, isn't he? I seem to recall Claude is 3ish?

[mncavylover]

Aww, poor little guy! I'm glad he has someone knowledgable to take care of him, as others have said. Good luck to all the pigs, especially Patrick!

[salana]

Einy will be 2 at the end of July. Sullivan is older than Einy by at least a year. You could write to the Gainesville rescue and ask them. Claude is 3. Rio is more or less the same age as Sullivan. KM knows of some breeders who breed lethals, one of whom is (was) supposed to have a 7-year-old male knocking up all the sows with dalmatian babies.

[Erin8607]

Jin's Rio from Teresa? The last I had stopped in to read, she had passed away. I think it was quite a few months ago.

[holli'smommy]

that little guy is adorable! he is one lucky piggie to have people around him that are wiling to go the extra mile for him. I hope everything works out for him and has a happy little life.

[salana]

Too bad about Rio. I wonder what she died of, if it was related to being a lethal or something different.

[pinknt]

Myguiea pig has just had 2 babies - one is black, and fine, the other, an almost all white but not totally, one, is also fine, except that it has one eye which appears to be blind. Could it be a 'lethal' one, or does anyone know why it is like this?