Breeding: What if I keep the babies?

[Justin]

Originally Posted by Crazy4cavys

I got to go, my mom is making me go to bed...

This must be a joke.

[pigsforlife]

Firstly, it doesnt matter at all if you plan on keeping the babies. You are still ADDING to the over population problem. For every pig that comes into this world because of people like you another dies in a rescue. A perfectly healthy, normal happy pig dies because it doesnt have a home. A home that could have quite easily been provided had that person not bred her/his pigs. Why do you want to breed? Is it because you want to see the bubs come into this world? Because, you can quite easily experience that by fostering a pregnant sow. Just from your first few posts on this forum I can tell you know absolutely nothing, nada about pigs, genetics etc. Otherwise their wouldnt be this big thing about Albinos. You find for me, one reputable site that lists Albino as a piggy breed. You wont find one. There are PEWs, DEWs and plenty of other breeds but not Albino. You just dont understand at all. WHY breed? Are you going to provide homes for all of the pigs you breed, and then homes for all of the pigs at the rescues due to be put to sleep as their time is up? Do you have C&C cages, and feed your pigs top quality food (KMs, Oxbow) with veggies supplied in plentiful amounts? You want to breed for selfish reasons. The pig will not benefit from it, pigs all over the world wont benefit from it, most likely the bubs will go to homes where their owners are all kids who give them up once the novelty has worn off. Also I find it hard to understand how you can compare humans to pigs? In that humans (most of the time) get to choose whether or not they want a child. Pigs dont get that choice, they are defenceless little critters.

[krittercrazy]

Is the guinea pig you are talking about breeding a rescue? If so, where did you rescue her from? Any true rescue group would have made you sign a contract in which breeding the guinea pig would be grounds for removing it from you and likely never adopting to you again. Even if you got her from an individual rehoming their guinea pig, it would be very irresponsible of you to breed her. A responsible pet owner having to rehome their pet for whatever reason would not want their pet bred.

You say that guinea pig over population is not as bad as dogs and cats. How do you think that the dog and cat over population got to where it is? Even now, I hear people say I want my dog or cat to have one litter because:
-I can have one just like her/him to remember her/him by (dumping the rest of the litter or when they realise they miscalculated how much work and money is involved dumping mom and offspring they thought they wanted)
-my children can experience the miracle of birth - what a wonderful lesson(not thinking they are learning another lesson when mom and offspring are dumped on the side of the road when they are too much work.)

If you want the experience, why not volunteer with the rescue. I can assure you that there are plenty of irresponsible and clueless people out there (even in your area) that will be dumping their guinea pigs,as well as people who have hit on hard times in their lives and find themselves having to do the difficult thing of giving up their pets.

You claim to be prepared in case of complications, be it in the form of difficulty with the pregnancy, giving birth, birth defects. This would indicate that you are financially able to handle being hit with vet bills in the hundreds of dollars. Would you not consider it morally responsible to not create these problems. Would it not be better to put your resourses to use helping what is already here.

You compared animals to having offspring to humans having offspring. Animals do not have free will. Animals are governed by humans that have them in captivity or by instinct. Humans have free will.

[VoodooJoint]

Originally Posted by Crazy4cavys

Albinism is NOT a breed, it is a birth defect that causes there to be no color pigments in an animal.

Not quite. It's cause by recessive alleles. While albinism does exist what people are trying to make you understand is that it DOESN'T exist in Guinea pigs. It is impossible for it to exist in guinea pigs because they do not possess the particular alleles responsible for albinism. Therefore a pink eyed white guinea pig is just that, a-pink-eyed-white-guinea-pig NOT an albino.

There are certain animals that CANNOT create albinos. The closest thing they can produce is a "lethal". When the "improper" alleles (which would be normal, recessive alleles in other animals) meet they create a "lethal", a creature that is usually lacking in much pigmentation as well as also inheriting severe deformities. These can be anything from deafness (which is survivable) to severely deformed eyes, teeth, digestive tracts, limbs and so many other variables that it's impossible to list them. MOST of these deformities cannot be survived and usually lead to death soon after birth.

Those deformities CAN and DO exist in guinea pigs and I doubt you have even the slightest clue as to how to distinguish a potential cross that can create a lethal. Here's a clue. YOU HAVE NO IDEA! Since you do not know the genetic background of your guinea pig you would have no way of knowing if the cute little babies you want, and think your guinea pig wants, will come out to be malformed and suffering creatures that you, and your guinea pig, will have the infinite joy of watching slowly die. What FUN!!!

Originally Posted by Crazy4cavys

Honestly, if there was nearly as many piggs as there where dogs and cats ... but where I am there are none beeing put to sleep, or abused.

You have no idea. You are so very wrong. There are loads of guinea pigs being abused right now. Some are probably within a few blocks from you. Do you want to know why you aren't seeing as many in your local rescues (although I doubt you really looked all that hard) it's because most people either allow the guinea pig to slowly die of neglect and poor care in some basement, garage or outdoor cage. Most of those came from the petstores where they were bought as a "child's pet", or as an impulse purchase. Once the newness wears off they are forgotten about and allowed to die in filth.

Do you want to know another reason why you aren't seeing as many in rescues? It's because many people set their guinea pigs "free" when they don't want them anymore. They let them go in parks, golfcourses, forests and sometimes just their backyards to fend for themselves. They usually know, but simply don't care that they can't survive. As long as they are gone it's no longer their problem.

Do you know that the SPCA believes is the #1 abandoned (set free) animal is? It's not the cat, it's not even the dog, they believe it's the rabbit. Unfortunately, unlike dogs and cats, so few survive their release for long that it's hard to pinpoint. Do you honestly think guinea pigs are being treated any better?

So sure, go ahead and breed, breed BREEEEED and feel free to ignore the craigslist and newspaper ads full of people looking to dump their pets. If you have filled up your home with cutie wootie little babies and can't take them in then I'm certain it won't bother you to know that it's very likely the owners will just set it free to live a natural and long life in the wilderness like nature intended (are you catching my sarcasm?) or maybe they will just give it to a reptile owner as food.

Oh well, what do you care, right?

Originally Posted by Crazy4cavys

I'm just saying they breed to survive, so doesn't that mean they want to breed

Their instinct tell them to breed to reproduce their numbers so that they don't die out. Guess what? There is no reason when they are in safe captivity and under your protection for them to breed. Their instincts are false and they do not have the full understanding of what reproduction is. Their mating runs on hormones and circumstance NOT on some sort of romantic notion. You cannot humanize them to that extent. NO animal desires to be a mother or a father. You can see that everyday in the millions of happy, healthy and well adjusted spayed and neutered animals.

YOU may desire to have cutie wootie babies but your guinea pig does not. Your pig wants a large comfortable home, interesting things to do and explore, healthy and varied food, water and preferably companionship. It is not thinking, "oh, I have nearly everything in life, now if only I had a baby". That sort of thinking is something that only humans, and perhaps some higher primates and sea mammals, are capable of. It's not the guinea pig that wants babies, it's you. If you want a baby so bad then why don't YOU have one? Endanger your life, health and future, NOT your pet's. You are the one that compared their "desire" for children to the human desire. If that's true and both are equal then you have the baby. That animal is not your toy.

If you still want to do this thing then no one can stop you. You have been given reasons not to and appraised of the facts. You can act compassionately and maturely or selfishly and childishly. Take your pick.

[PigWooBus]

Kritterkrazy just said exactly what I was thinking... where did this person adopt their pig from? That rescue deserves a heads-up so they can try to get the pig back.

[Percy's Mom]

Originally Posted by Crazy4cavys

I am not a typical breeder and their are no pigs 4 adoption where I live, that proves there is not as much of an overpopulation.

Originally Posted by Crazy4cavys

...then there would be some up for adoption, there are less then 10 left in the adoption center where I am located, and they all have adoptions pending.

Make up your mind. Are there no pigs for adoption, or are the few available pending adoption? If there are stores selling pigs, and people buying pigs, more pigs will show up in the adoption center within a very short time period.

Originally Posted by Crazy4cavys

When I first got her I thought that was her skin tone, after I gave her a bath I found out it was just grime from the pet store that was on her ears.

So, your current PEW pig (pink eyed white, NOT albino) isn't a rescue or adoption after all. She was purchased from a store where, as is typically the case, she was kept in horrible conditions. You took her home and emptied out a spot for the store to fill with more pigs from breeders and pet mills.

Originally Posted by Crazy4cavys

OK, I'm sorry about the text speak! It is a habbit I am trying to break, don't bann me, I don't even realize I am doing it.

I hate to tell you this, but if you can't even control how and what you type, and don't use a spell check before submitting a simple forum post, you shouldn't be breeding anything. Incidently, "habbit" only has 1 b (habit), and "bann" only has 1 n (ban).

[rabbitsncavyluv]

There are no albino guinea pigs. The trait does not appear in guinea pigs.

You are a backyard breeder no matter how you put it.

And if there is a guinea pig rescue near you, (heck if there is a pet store near you) then that means there are homeless and needy guinea pigs near you.

Your friends don't have to have guinea pigs, and if they wanted some, they could adopt. If they don't have guinea pigs already, there is likely a reason for it.

What if they change their minds, either now or down the road. Guinea pigs live up to 7-8 years. What if they are not caring for them properly?

[rabbitsncavyluv]

By the way, do you know what roans and lethal whites are?

Many pregnancies have complications. Are you prepared to lose your sow and any babies?

[Ziggy&Herald]

Apparently you are just wanting to breed for babies. I would hope your mother has more sense than to just let you breed your pig. This would cause more financial strain on her because I doubt you buy the supplies needed for your pig you have. Quit being so selfish, and listen to the advice of experienced adults. Also, you still have not voluntered up the area you live in for the members on here to do a quick search that more then likely will pop up with many animals in your area that need homes. Leave these discussions to someone who can actually decide for themselves, instead of having to OK it with Mommy first.

[crazywiggy]

Firstly -
So, you are not legally considered responsible for any pets you have. You do not have your own income to support your pets. You are totally reliant on your parents. Are you 100% certain your parents would be happy to spend $100s on vet care if necessary? An emergency ceasarian for example? Repeated vet bills for teeth cutting if your piggies pups turn out to have malocclusion? What about a piggie with heart problems?

So you want to keep the babies... even if they turn out to have expensive health problems? What if they don't get on? Do you have the time, money, space and commitment for a minimum 2x3 c+c cage for every pup? And you mentioned giving them to friends... I assume this is school friends? Do you know how irresponsible it is to give/sell live animals to minors? You even said yourself your friends probably wouldn't get piggies if you didn't breed them - so your friends obviously don't really want them, they would just take them if they were on offer? Nice. Very nice.

I can't get my head round why you WANT to breed ni the first place - you have already said you don't want more pigs....
If you don't want more, don't breed any. If you do want more, you can adopt and save lives. It's not rocket science.

Breeding is very risky....

It is estimated that the sow has a 1 in 4 chance of dying through complications arising during pregnancy and birth. You are risking your piggies life (and I don't rate the odds) for what reason? To better the species, and produce stronger, healthier animals? No... obviously not.

Guinea pigs, like other species, can suffer from a variety of diseases which have a hereditary component. Unless you know the genetic background of both parents, you would likely be breeding babies with serious, potentially fatal, health problems. Even if your sow seems to be in perfect health, many of these problems are not seen until later in life - well beyond the age at which it is safe for them to breed.

You are right that guinea pigs have an instinct to breed. In fact, every species on the planet has the basic instinct to survive and reproduce. This doesn't mean they actually WANT to have babies. It certainly doesn't mean that they SHOULD have babies.

I'm always surprised when people try to say "there are no unwanted piggies near me". I doubt this is the case. If there are pet stores in your area selling pigs to impulse buyers there are definately going to piggies being dumped.
You asy there are 10 in your local rescue now.... keep checking that. Chances are they only have space for 10, and have about 10 at all times. And don't forget many unwanted pigs never make it to rescues. Try checking craigslist and petfinder. Where I live there are almost always ads in the local newspapers for "free to a good home" guinea pigs.

Even if there are really no unwanted pigs currently near you - why would you want to change that? Every time a pig is bred the population goes up. It won't be long before the overpopulation gets worse.

I just don't understand your logic:

You don't want to get more pigs - but you want to breed them.

You claim you are not a BYB but have no money for these animals, and know nothing about breeding, or about the ancestry and genetics of your piggies, and would give them to kids.

You claim there is no overpopulation - but there are 10 pigs in 1 rescue near you.

You have obviously read the info about the risks of breeding etc - yet you don't want to believe what the EXPERTS are telling you.

You claim you love your animals but you would put their lives at risk, condemn others piggies to abandoment and death, all on a selfish whim?

PLEASE - if you can do anything to prove that you are not the selfish, irresponsible, childish, BYB wannabe you are coming across as - go ahead, prove me wrong.

[Biscuit]

This one isn't going to go anywhere....

Just try to separate yourself from your anger over people disagreeing with you and "being mean" as you see it. From a selfish perspective, don't do something you will feel guilty about later when you grow up and can see it more clearly. The guilt never goes away.

[piggly wiggly]

It's funny that you keep mentioning that it is instinct for a piggie to breed, but humans make the concious decision to have babies. Well you are right there, because we can choose to use birth control. Are you offering your piggie this option for her to make the decision if she would like to have babies, or if she would like to live with a male but use birth birth control?
If your piggie does not have the option to make a choice, then that means you are making the decision for her. If she is in a cage with a male where she can not get away from him, then she has no choice, she will be bred weither she likes it or not, that means you are forcing her. She did not ask you to put her in with a male so she can have some babies.

[auburnmare5]

I don't understand either why you want to breed.
For everytime you breed, more healthy pigs in shelters are being put down. Your pig cannot make the choice to breed or not to breed on their own; it is instinctive.
Are your parents really willing to spend possibly in the thousands of dollars trying to care for possibly sick gp pups? Do you really have enough room for all of them? ENOUGH KNOWLEDGE ON HOW TO CARE FOR THEM? Do you know they will find good homes?
As mentioned ealier, if you want pups, go to a RESCUE and get a pregnant pig that may have been bred. Then you have adopted, and gotten the pups. But please remember, all o fthe pigs in your care will rely on you for everything 24/7.
Carefully go through evrything that you would need financially, and for care, etc... Then ask yourself, am I really ready for something as serious as this?

[babybunny]

As stated before if you have a guinea pig rescue in the area that means there is a reason for that. If it is empty now, then I am sure if you wait there will be more piggies there eventually.

Once I learned of homeless guinea pigs I spent 5 months trying to find one in the area to adopt. There is no rescues near by, there was none in the paper and all the shelters and animal control places in a 60 mile radius were called every week trying to find a friend for my Elvis. However, 2 hours away sat 35+ guinea pigs needing homes. I finally was able to go there and pick out one. It was so hard seeing all those precious pairs, trios and single piggies needing homes.

So in short, just because there isn't anything seemly available near by doesn't mean there isn't an abuse or overpopulation issue. Breeding will only add to that. "Don't breed or buy while shelter animals die."

[salana]

Originally Posted by Crazy4cavys

Guinea pigs can feel every emothion we can!!

It is debatable that they can, but whether they have the capacity doesn't mean they will. Case in point. I have a sow, I got her from the pet store before I knew better, and she was pregnant with two little boars, one of whom was a lethal white (a pig with a genetic deformity that messed up his teeth and made him blind and deaf).

Suzi hated Einstein, the lethal, from the time he was about a day old. She liked Jackie until he hit puberty and was moved to another cage. Then after she was fixed and they were reintroduced, she tried to tear his ears off. So no, no maternal affection there.

Originally Posted by Crazy4cavys

And it is possible for any animal to have the albonism gene. It is a birth defect in a cromosohm that causes there to be no color pigments in their body. Not all pigs that ar white with red eyes are albino, but it is possible.

It's possible, but it doesn't actually occur in guinea pigs.

Anyway, you have no idea whether your white pig is a secret roan. I have no idea whether your pig is a secret roan. Breeding guinea pigs is irresponsible; breeding a white pig of unknown genetic background is extra irresponsible.

[ellenvega]

How many posts does it take to say the same thing?

I doubt she's coming back.

[VoodooJoint]

She came back and immediately broke enough rules to get herself caged.

[charlie23]

People are mad at you because by breeding your pig you are risking her life. Why would you want to risk the life of a pet you claim to love so very much. I brought to pigs as girls and one was a boy so we ended up with a pregnant sow. I was more worried that the sow i had become attached to would die in labour. Yes the babies are cute but if you care about your current pigs dont risk her life!

[Amsley246]

In the case of a Guinea Pig being an Albino, it's actually called a lethal. If it has no Pigment whatsoever and almost always has problems. I know this from experience as I have one of these types. If your thinking about breeding, which like most people have said, you really shouldn't, but I'm not going to shove that at you, then you need to take the breeds into consideration first. Certain breeds, called Roans and Dalmations, pass on a genetic deformalities and can make babies known as "Lethals". They can have problems that can range anywheres from blindness, deafness, severe teeth problems and big internal problems. Most of them don't live pass birth, some after weening and a few, only a couple months. Thier have been a few that have lasted a couple years, but have died from internal problems. Some of them need to be handfed every hour on the hour, have their teeth clipped every few weeks (lots of costly vet bills), and just need constant care and supervision. Sometimes one or two are born like this out of a litter, sometimes the whole litter has been born like this. A lot of times though, they don't make it sadly. Nobody knows why this happens with these breeds but it does and the only way to prevent it is to not breed.

Even with other breeds, while trouble with labor is usualy small, it still does happen on a regular basis and you could end up losing everyone.

[Ly&Pigs]

In the case of a Guinea Pig being an Albino, it's actually called a lethal.

Just to add, there are technically no such things as albino's in pigs. Not all pigs people think of as albinos are lethals. You have PEWs which are Pink-Eyed Whites and sometimes DEWs which are Dark-Eyed Whites. A pig with no pigment whatsoever will most usually be a lethal.