Ethical?

[dextersmycutegp]

Is it ethical to not treat an older pig for something like ovarian cysts if it definetly goes against the pig's personality?
For instance, a really shy pig that is very depressed away from other pigs, being forced to go to the vet a lot, and being in quaratine alone after a spay surgery
(at 6 years old, and a low likelihood of recovery).
I was just thinking about this because of how old Smores is getting. One day she is probably going to have a problem like that, since she has a few of the symptoms but nothing has been found yet. I worry that I either won't do what's happiest for her and keep her here too long or I won't do enough and let her go too soon...

I hope this is the right place to put this. If it's not, feel free to move it.

[mbator]

Personally I would not treat one that old, keep her as long as she is comfortable, but once a piggy is suffering from old age no matter what it is, I would put the piggy down out of love and respect so that she does not suffer. Since 6 years of age is up there for a piggy I would say she had a good life.

[paula.m.moore]

I think it would depend on the pig and the situation. Like all animals, they can't speak and as your pet, you know them better than anyone and have to make decisions for their care based on what you know about the animal's personality and preferences.

Sometimes it can be cruel to prolong a pet's suffering and as hard as it always is to let them go, we are never more obliged to speak for them and make hard decisions about their dignity and their quality of life than when they are facing a critical health issue or at the end of their lives.

[VoodooJoint]

I would not consider it wise to spay a GP at that age. However I don't think it's in the animal's best interest to allow it to go untreated IF you can find appropriate treatment for her.

I highly recommend Hormone injections for an older pig with cysts. The hormone Lupron can have remarkable results and greatly increase the quality of life, health and well-being for an older cyst-pig in which surgery is not an option.

The only problem with the treatment is that not all vets have Lupron or are even willing to purchase it. It's not a cheap drug and you will likely have charges of about $50-$80 per injection. Injections may be needed every 6 months to keep the cysts in check although there have been instances of the hormone totally getting rid of the cysts with no recurrence happening.

To me it's worth it because ovarian cysts can be very irritating, both physically and hormonally, ans can cause great pain if they become too enlarged or attach to other organs.

You can learn more about cysts and their treatment on this thread http://www.guineapigcages.com/forum/...inea-pigs.html

[Pumpkin_RIP]

Think of it this way: You are about 65 years old, you feel kind of sick, then it starts to get worse. So, you go to the doctors. They say that ts is serious and you need to stay overnight. Now, heres where it gets sticky; you can either stay for treatment....or die. You have had a great life, with lots of friends. Your not in terrible pain. Now, which one would YOU choose?

That is basically your piggies situation in human form. I know that your pig might not quite understand the circumstances, but they are smarter than we think and would probably know something about what's going on when she does get sick. I find that many people go the easy way: putting an animal to sleep. They use the excuses such as, "The animal is in too much pain" or something like that. Or, "They are old anyways, it's no point in trying to help them." I agree that sometimes they are in a huge amount of pain that can never be fixed, but that is actually not as common as you may believe. I think that both you and I would want the person taking care of us to help us even if we were old and sick. Even if the operation was risky. I know I would.
So, my advice is when she does get sick, do everything you can to help her, and don't give up on your piggie, because you are her only hope.
Good luck, and I hope she doesn't actually get ovarian cyst or anything like that.

[pigsforlife]

I dont think I could/would put such an elderly pig through such a hard and invasive operation. The chances that the pig were to even survive are very minimal, it would be very hard on the pigs little body and even if she did survive she may never recover properly. I dont think that it is fair nor right to compare humans to pigs, we are so different and the level of skills of human surgeons and exotic specialists vary a lot. Personally, I would go down the route of the hormone therapy, using pain relief if/when needed. But if the pig was in so much pain, with no way of recovering and if her quality of life was being affected I think I would have to consider putting her to sleep.

[thalestral]

I also recommend hormone injections. Two of my girls are on hCG injections for ovarian cysts - definitely something to look into here and on Guinea Lynx and discuss with your vet

Rosie's thread: http://www.guineapigcages.com/forum/...good-vets.html

[Pumpkin_RIP]

I agree that if the animal is in a lot of pain and there is nothing you can do about it, then putting them to sleep is probably best. I'm just saying to not give up on her. But, from what I read it seems that she isn't even sick yet, so you may have nothing to worry about.

[pigsmakemesmile]

This seems like an issue over quality vs quantity. As my pigs have grown older, I've made the decision not to prolong my pigs life through surgery,however I would put him through pain management to keep him as pain free and comfortable as possible until the good lord calls his name. Unless ovarian cysts are causing a life threatening condition or affecting the animals vital organs only then after exploring all other avenues and alternatives keeping in mind the age of the animal, would I consider surgery as an option. If ovarian cysts are causing discomfort, then I would use forms of pain management with guidence from an experienced vet. I'd be concerned about the use of hormone injections as hormones are chemicals. Some synthetic and some from other living sources. This is a touchy subject opened to a lot of interpretation. Of course we all want what's for the best interest of the animal and it's through obtaining knowledge on what ever the medical condition is that arise, is how we can make the best decision. Whether it's the right or wrong choice, unfortunately we'll never know for certain what really is. All I can do is provide the best life possible to my 6 pigs and hope that they remain healthy and treat them appropriately as needed including bringing them in for regular checkups to catch a condition early. In use of HRT's I would do research if there are natural alternatives in the treatment of animals for a hormone related condition.

[Rachy1412]

I am going through this dilemma myself right now. I have a male pig with a bladder stone, he is 6yrs 4months old. Currently he is fine, he eats, is active and happy but does cry when going to the bathroom. I manage his pain with metacam and have ordered some shilington(sp?). If he was to start to loose weight or to stop eating then I would go ahead with the surgery. I have had a 2yr old die from a neutering operation and another 3yr old die from a mammary tumor operation, so I am very reserved about putting an elderly pig through it.

If the pig is getting to the stage where it is in alot of pain and the only way to stop that is to put them to sleep I would always opt for surgery first, even if there was just the slightest chance of them recovering and living even another month then I'd go for it, screw the money!

[Char-x]

I've always said about my elderly male that if he got an illness where surgery was needed he wouldn't have it, just because he is now nearly 7 and he has only ever been to the vets once and he lost his hair through stress which says alot about him...I don't think I would really like him to be put up in the vets for a long period of time ethier like over night since he causes himself an intense amount of stress I think he would do himself no favours. It's a toughy but I would say it's up to the owner, after all I know Hoover my pig probabaly wouldn't come out of an op because of his age/past and his hate of the vets...

[Toadies]

With all of my pets, regardless of age or species, I always opt for the least invasive treatment first. If you go for the more drastic, you have no where else to go. I have repeatedly found that the least invasive method has worked well. And if not, then I can decide how much I am willing to put my baby through. I agree with paulammoore in that you know your pet and can better decide which way you want to go. YOU have to be comfortable with your decision because there's no going back on some of them. I wish you and your baby the best.

[Susan9608]

Is GnRH the same in guinea pigs as it is in humans? I'm curious how you can use a hormone for human beings on non human animals and have it work in the same way.

ETA: Also, depending on where you're located and how expensive your vet is, lupron can cost up to $200. It's very expensive.

[dextersmycutegp]

Thank you for all your responses. I'll definetly consider the injections and mention them to my vet.
You guys have really made me feel better.

[thalestral]

Originally Posted by pigsmakemesmile

I'd be concerned about the use of hormone injections as hormones are chemicals. Some synthetic and some from other living sources.

Hormone injections have a high rate of success in shrinking and even sometimes disappearing ovarian cysts. Please do not put people off the idea of using a treatment that can prolong a guinea pigs life by years or even cure them of their ailment.

hCG is in fact apparently taken from the urine of pregnant women, not animals, so animal use here is not an issue.

There are various links you can see just from googling that show hCG works in all domesticated and pet mammals. My trusted vet is quite happy to use it and has reported no side effects in any of the animals he has treated. My own girls are much better for having been treated with these injections.

hCG only costs me £10 an injection so I doubt it is very expensive in the US either.

Again, this is a treatment that is invaluable when it comes to those sows who cannot be operated on! It can save lives, improve quality of life, and extend a life span in health and happiness.

[Susan9608]

Lupron and hCG are different.

What was discussed earlier in this thread was lupron, specifically, which is actually *quite* expensive.