Dogs Die to Teach Peru Soldiers How to Kill

[~Fala~]

Yes, you said you chose not to come back, so I wanted to let you know that I appreciate your post, I apologize for misunderstanding, and the other stuff that I put in my PM. You know, so you could stick to your choice to not read this thread, and still receive what I wanted to tell you. That's the opposite of asking you to read this thread. Thanks for letting me know by PM that you don't care what I think, you're just forgetting this thread, and to not PM you any more--that's the sort of thing that you should PM. I'll respect your wishes and not PM you, of course, but I really think it's better to PM than post this sort of thing.

I didn't know you had email notifications enabled for this thread.

Weatherlight

I would greatly appreciate it if you would stop telling me what to do. "The opposite of asking me to read this" is ..telling me not to read it. I also find it annoying, as it appears to me, you trying to force your opinion on everyone. You've stated what you think, not sure about everyone else but I certainly get the point already. Like I said in the PM I don't care anymore, you've stated your opinion so much I'm totally ignoring everything after the first post. Only because I think it is unneccisary to argue when you've already stated your opinion. A choice I'm allowed to make. Yes, I'm posting my opinion again, I am trying my best not to argue and rather end this I think meaningless debate. What will come of this? Who will win? Nothing, no one is what I think. I also think that no one person on this earth is 100 pct correct about this situation therefore no one wins.

Also I wouldn't go around quoteing every little thing someone says saying it's wrong, other's think differently. We all have minds we are all capable of thinking we all can have our own opinions. Quoting every little thing everyone says I find highly unneccisary. The only reason I am quoting is because your posts are full of quotes and questions and I just separated the section I think is referring to me out so I can think more clearly because, yes I can think for myself.

Even if I didn't have e-mail notification I do have a brain. Not sure if you know or not. I can remember this thread and decide to come back to it if I wanted to. You PMing me was forcing me to deal with you again. You are an inconvenience to me wether you think you are or not. You can't say you're not because only I can say what is what for myself. Obviously I decided to PM you back and decided to post when I didn't have to, only to tell you to stop inconveniencing me and to state my opinion as I'm allowed to do.

My opinion on this thread: I haven't seen any facts yet that it truely is better that the troops torture this dog and not get punished for it. Or any facts saying it is OK to train for war by killing innocent dogs. (Sentient creatures)

I also think it would be in-humane to pack them in salt or whatever, however I do believe they should be punished. Not neccesarily physically but in some way. What they did was totally barbaric. I think a horrible way to train for war, great way to train to becoming murderers though.

However, in general if I had to choose who to shoot (not that I would have to be in the situation to do this, nor would I want to be in this situation, and I wouldn't want to shoot anything) I would sadly choose the dog as humans are more important than dogs no matter what my feelings inside tell me. (I would deep down rather shoot the man than the dog . .but that's cruel as humans live longer than dogs, I am a human, sometimes can be more helpful, are smarter, and much more... all in general though there are other ways like a service dog is more helpful in the community than a vegetable person) Another thing, stating your opinion and saying your opinion is true and other's are not is wrong. (I think)

Also weatherlight, if you are wondering why I am mainly focusing on you is because you are the one who started the debate and are the one who PMed me and I think also you're the one who keeps criticizing everything everyone else says. As you saw above, Justin posted his opinion that was basically saying it wasn't all that bad to do what these troops were doing, however they didn't criticise anyone else's post like I believe you did with your quotes.

I am stating my opinion in this whole post, freedom of speech. If you don't like it, fine, you don't have to think it's right.

[~Fala~]

Sorry for double posting, not going to edit so I don't get criticized or somethign..but anyway. Quoting myself

you've stated your opinion so much I'm totally ignoring everything after the first post

When saying everything after the first post, I ment everything as the first post has quotes that start the arguement and there isn't really an opinion in that post. I think there is criticism of some other's posts though. (rather I KNOW because it is a fact that you were criticizing them.)

edit: will edit this one,

Just want to say I pretty much totally agree with you're last post Piggly Wiggly.

[Justin]

Originally Posted by ~Fala~

Justin posted his opinion that was basically saying it wasn't all that bad to do what these troops were doing

Hi, Thank you for mentioning me!

Well, I said it's very effective training method. I also implied that it's very necessary for the bad politicians. But I personally think what the troops did are disgusting, bad, and evil. Please, do I sound that bad?

Anyway, I think pickling human meat is not o.k. (although it could taste o.k.)
Just mentioning it for fun is not o.k. either. Well, because, it all start from there. In addition, I am not pond of revenge either.

[~Fala~]

Originally Posted by Justin

Hi, Thank you for mentioning me!

Well, I said it's very effective training method. I also implied that it's very necessary for the bad politicians. But I personally think what the troops did are disgusting, bad, and evil. Please, do I sound that bad?

Anyway, I think pickling human meat is not o.k. (although it could taste o.k.)
Just mentioning it for fun is not o.k. either. Well, because, it all start from there. In addition, I am not pond of revenge either.

Sorry! Was just emplying that you had feelings that it wasn't all bad, not 100 pct bad that they are doing this. It seemed to me that mostly everyone else before your post sounded as if it was horrible and 100 pct bad. I was just using you as an example that you were showing your opinion, not criticizing others right off the bat.

edit: this just shows, no ONE person on this earth is 100 pct correct all the time. edit 2: keep having to edit so I don't potentially get criticised for saying something. I ment, no one person is correct, I'm not correct all the time, but I'm not meaning I'm correct a lot of the time and I don't mean I'm correct usually..if you know what I mean?

[Justin]

Originally Posted by ~Fala~

Sorry! Was just emplying that you had feelings that it wasn't all bad, not 100 pct bad that they are doing this. It seemed to me that mostly everyone else before your post sounded as if it was horrible and 100 pct bad. I was just using you as an example that you were showing your opinion, not criticizing others right off the bat.

You are a psychic and also a good one. I admit that I thought it's not 100 pct bad at the time of reply, as the trained soldiers could fight for my country. As a defense, that's only because I didn't think very hard at the time. I hope that wouldn't make me horrible person.

Anyway, I thank you for appraising my attitude. But I wanted to criticize pickling and salt idea as an unacceptable opinion, only in a little lesser tone. I didn't because Weatherlight did better job than I could.

[~Fala~]

No that doesn't make you a horrible person I don't think, I myself agreed to it. There is logical reasoning behind it. Even though I don't actually agree, I just see where you're coming from.

Also wanted to say that I ment implying not emplying..

And that I know I'm pretty much criticizing some people myself. When I said Weatherlight was criticizing everything everyone was saying I ment mostly everything and that's seemed to be all they were doing. . ?

edit: Not saying I'm finnished posting, but I'm honestly tired of thinking out every word I say because it has potential to be criticized that's why I "left" the other 2 times. I was tired of the arguement and tired of thinking more than I really should have to, just to answer a simple thread. I'm not complaining about thinking, just that it is a waste of energy and time.

[Justin]

Originally Posted by Weatherlight

Have I mentioned how delightful you can be? The necessity of sacrificing sentient beings wouldn't make me "up."

That's why I think I am morally immature.

Originally Posted by Weatherlight

I haven't bought any worms. I'm thinking some will feed off my compost piles, though.

Anyway, it doesn't have to be sacrifice. Worms could happily live in the bins and maintain healthy population. Red wrigglers are voracious eaters and will turn most of your kitchen garbage into organic fertilizer, but they are not technically "earthworms." They don't dig and won't survive on soil. So once you have them, you are stuck with them.

[Weatherlight]

Who are you to say I am stating things that are false?

A person who thinks. Any person can accurately state that a statement is factually untrue. Hmm scripts can do that too.

"Rabbits are cute," "Rabbits are boring," "Rice cakes are tasty," "Rice cakes taste bad," "The moon is pretty," or "The moon is ugly" are opinions.

"Rabbits do not live on, nor make rice cakes on, the moon," "Whether rabbits are cute or not is subjective," and "Rice cakes are made from rice and sometimes other ingredients" are facts.

I'm sorry if you don't know the difference between the objective and the subjective. I don't claim that my subjective views are objectively correct. I claim that objective facts are objectively correct, by definition.

If you really want to reduce the rates of this sort of thing, if you really want to defend potential victims, and you were motivated enough to do something about it, you would support efforts to reduce pain/violence--particularly towards infants, children, and teenagers--and increase somatosensory pleasure. This is based on fact. If you don't much, and you really just want to get revenge, then support sadistic torture all you like, just know that it's not the same thing.

obviously you are the only one who is factual

I was the only one being factual in this thread about the correlation between the death penalty and crime. If you were truly interested in having an opinion that conforms to fact, you would educate yourself. It's like saying "My opinion is that everyone should give rabbit pellets to adult guinea pigs, because they are healthier than Cavy Cuisine or KM's pellets." It's an opinion based on a falsehood; the latter part of the sentence is factually untrue. If the person learned the real facts, they might or might not change their opinion, but I would hope they would.

saying that myself and others are saying false things just for the fun of it

Please quote one example where I said anyone was saying false things "just for the fun of it."

I thought so. I am now saying that you made a false accusation against me personally. Could you stop?

Man it must be nice to be pshycic, I wish I was.

Sometimes I wish I was psychic, yeah. It might be nice. But then again, it might not be. I guess it depends on how it worked. Totally off topic, though.

"The opposite of asking me to read this" is ..telling me not to read it.

No, I'm saying that the opposite is not telling you to read it. Big difference. You're going on and on about how I'm not respecting your choice about this thread, yada yada, when I specifically PMed you so I could communicate no matter what you chose about reading this thread, so you would be free to choose either way even if you wanted to know what I said. If that's way over your head, I won't explain again.

You're doing a really good job of leaving the thread, not caring about what I say, not arguing, etc by posting tons of criticism about what I say =\ There's no shame in admitting that you care about what I say, enough to say many paragraphs about it, is there? Isn't that the whole point of communication, to care about what other people say? If you really don't want to deal with me, you do have the CHOICE of not dealing with me. You can stop communicating with me. I'm not forcing you to read anything I type, and I'm not forcing you to type to me. You have a brain and can think for yourself whether to do these things, right?

I am trying my best not to argue

Congrats. Why bother? Continue to argue away all you like!

rather end this I think meaningless debate. What will come of this? Who will win? Nothing, no one is what I think. I also think that no one person on this earth is 100 pct correct about this situation therefore no one wins.

Is life all about "winning" to you? Can't some things, like forum discussions, be about communication, disagreements, and learning, not winning vs losing?

I wonder, if those men and those they were involved with saw things less in terms of winning or losing, how much they'd want to participate in wars and torture in the first place. So much of the world has the "us vs them" mentality. Shouldn't it be "us and hopefully them vs problems and obstacles to good goals"?

Also I wouldn't go around quoteing every little thing someone says saying it's wrong, other's think differently.

That's the beauty of it. I can think, you can think, everyone else in this thread can think. We can read what everyone else says, then we can reply to it. We can criticize ideas, we can agree with ideas, we can build up on previous posts, and share what we know. Why do you think it's such a horrible thing? Disagreement per se isn't something to be avoided. Nor is disagreeing per se a bad thing. No one here is doing "bad" by disagreeing or criticizing. Nor does it make someone "worse" for disagreeing with many people as opposed to disagreeing with one or two. I've criticized what others wrote and others have criticized what I and others wrote, and in my opinion, that's a GOOD thing. I'd be weirded out if everyone shared the same opinion, although I'd be pleasantly surprised if everyone built their opinions on accurate facts.

If you really want to avoid having your posts criticized, the only guarantee for that is to not post.

Quoting is useful because I can quickly and easily show what it is I'm replying to. And, as you've seen, I like to reply a lot.

My opinion on this thread: I haven't seen any facts yet that it truely is better that the troops torture this dog and not get punished for it. Or any facts saying it is OK to train for war by killing innocent dogs.

"Better" and "OK" to/for what?

I think a horrible way to train for war, great way to train to becoming murderers though.

The death of one person is murder, but millions in war are statistics?

but that's cruel as humans live longer than dogs, I am a human, sometimes can be more helpful, are smarter, and much more... all in general though there are other ways like a service dog is more helpful in the community than a vegetable person

I don't think you being human makes either choice less or more cruel. As you said, it depends on the individual, so why not judge based on the individual?

Another thing, stating your opinion and saying your opinion is true and other's are not is wrong. (I think)

So are you doing wrong? =| I'd disagree.

Many times people have the opinion that their opinion is true. They're entitled to their opinions.

you are the one who started the debate

If by "started" you mean "disagreed with something previously posted." Although by that definition, if Person 1 posted that they breed gpigs and they think it's great, and Person 2 disagreed, then it would be Person 2 who "started the debate." I don't buy that.

are the one who PMed me

Huh, isn't that a reason to PM me back, and not a reason to write to me in the thread?

I think also you're the one who keeps criticizing everything everyone else says.

See above, I don't think that's a bad thing. (And I'm assuming you were using hyperbole.) Nor is it a bad thing if you think that me criticizing several other people's posts is reason for you to mainly criticize my posts.

I am stating my opinion in this whole post, freedom of speech. If you don't like it, fine, you don't have to think it's right.

Actually freedom of speech isn't a right here, but I get what you're saying. Sure, people state their opinion, people can like or dislike them, people can think they're right or not. Also people can dislike an opinion and still agree with it.

That's why I think I am morally immature.

What scale of moral maturity do you use?

Anyway, it doesn't have to be sacrifice.

Yeah, I'm thinking more along the lines of breeding.

So once you have them, you are stuck with them.

Remind me to never have any in my possession. If I were very vengeful I'd like to put you up for sale in a mail order catalog to eat garbage -_-

[Justin]

Originally Posted by Weatherlight

What scale of moral maturity do you use?

According to "Life-Span Development" by John W. Santrock, I am a late teenager. I am starting to understand moral concepts, but have problem applying it objectively.

BTW, if you are worried, you can also raise European night crawlers. They can live happily in your garden and compost file. I think it's good for both of the earth and earthworms. Also you can release all of them if you want. But they are much slower eater compare to red wrigglers.

[Weatherlight]

I don't breed or buy. At least, not intentionally. Even worms and insects.

"Extremist," I know!

[Biscuit]

Weatherlight, I enjoy your posts agree or disagree. I don't find them hostile or rude in the least, and I think you present your opinions as politely as possible considering the amount of flack you get. However, I don't think that will ever been seen that way by most because of the "extreme" nature of your views. You will always have trouble getting people to see past their gut reaction to your views, and see that you simply do not look at such arguements as a negative. Your points on the nature of forum discussions and how often things get out of hand simply because of the mind-set of winning/vs losing is one I have made even on gaming forums. Even when they get more heated and things that could be regarded as personal insults start to fly around, I don't find that particularly horrible.

Do you see people as basically good and only made "sick" by their environment and learning? That might be where some of the gap comes from. You are entirely more zen than I can cope with. =P I agree with you about killing the people, on an intellectual level. I understand everything you are saying and agree that you are correct. But I would still probably do it if I were there watching. Why? Because I am an angry person with potential to have my meager intellectual capacity utterly blinded by rage.

[Tamgirl1983]

I am an angry person with potential to have my meager intellectual capacity utterly blinded by rage.[/quote]



Aren't we all at times.

[Weatherlight]

'Lo Biscuit. One of my opinions is that people are basically good, yes. Another thing I think is that humans are horrible and I can hate dealing with them or thinking about them (one of my bnet accounts was "Misanthropist"). One thing I know is that humans, and the atoms and molecules that they are made of, have no more ultimate control over their actions than volcanoes and guns--and their atoms and molecules--do. Another thing I know is that it is no more relevant or rational to be prejudiced based on people's actions than on their ethnicity or species.

If your intellectual capacity is meager, what does that make mine?