Inside Petco...

[Susan9608]

I may have used the wrong word to explain that properly, but why do you keep on at me as though you think i dont understand that.

Because you haven't really said anything until this point that says that you do understand that fact. So far, it's been, "I may work for Petco/Petsmart/whatever, BUT ...[insert excuse here]"

In reality i am "supporting" pet stores but in my heart I dont. Please understand this.

I guess this is exactly what I don't understand. You don't support the idea of selling animals, but you're willing to do so for a living? It doesn't make sense to me.

Susan you really have it in for me dont you heh.

I don't "have it in" for anyone ... I do, however, believe very strongly that selling animals is wrong and that going along with it is wrong also.

[Calliso]

Originally Posted by Susan9608

Because you haven't really said anything until this point that says that you do understand that fact. So far, it's been, "I may work for Petco/Petsmart/whatever, BUT ...[insert excuse here]"



I guess this is exactly what I don't understand. You don't support the idea of selling animals, but you're willing to do so for a living? It doesn't make sense to me.





I don't "have it in" for anyone ... I do, however, believe very strongly that selling animals is wrong and that going along with it is wrong also.

Like I said before some people are lucky to have the jobs they do have. She may very well have little choice right now but to work there. Feeling good about what one is doing is nice..but unfortunately it donlt pay for squat. And while I agree that she should be looking for another job *which from what it sounds like she really is* Sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do. And without knowing the whole situation it is a bit unfair to judge her on what job she has.

[Susan9608]

I'm not so much criticizing her - or anyone working for a pet store - for working there. My issue is that pet store employees come to this openly anti-pet store forum and defend, defend, defend working in pet stores as some tremendous step forward for animals. Taking adequate care of the animals being sold in no way changes the fact that they are being sold - the one act doesn't negate the other. *That* is my issue.

I don't really care where people work - I care that they not have blinders on and try to convince others that they're doing anything but enabling a bad practice to continue.

[wheeky-UK]

*sigh* I am not working there for a living, you make it sound like im there for life, making a career out of it. I started working there over a year ago, and was very naive to this whole business.

Are you willing to pay my bills and loans for me while I try and change jobs? If only it was that easy to find another job, since everwhere I apply they say im overqualified . Iv told you in an earlier post i have a foot hold in a publishing business and am nearly there, just not quite, hense while im still working there.

[Susan9608]

I don't really care where people work - I care that they not have blinders on and try to convince others that they're doing anything but enabling a bad practice to continue.

[wheeky-UK]

I am not defending myself for working in a pet store, what im doing is telling you the REASON why i am still there. There is a difference.

[crazywiggy]

I think some of you may have misunderstood my post, so I will try to explain it better.

People have different opinions,ethics and morals, different interests and hobbies, different likes and dislikes.

Many people simply have no interest in animals. They don't think twice about animal issues such as welfare or rights or rescue. They eat whatever meat is put in front of them, don't keep pets.. etc. It isn't that these people are cruel or anything - they are just not interested in animals.

Many people are interested in and like animals - but this varies to different degrees. At one end of the scale are the people who are pro-rights, vegan etc who do everything in their power to help animals. But such extreme examples are very few and far between in the grand scheme of things. Most people are somewhere in the middle. A great many like animals enough to want to keep pets, but that is all. They have no interest in animal welfare issues. For example, most of the people I know fall into this category. They know about all the animals in rescue and being euthanised for want of a home - but they will only buy from breeders for whatever reason.

Look at the people who shop in pet stores - what do they have in common? They like and/or are interested in animals. They either keep pets or are intending to get some. You have already eliminated all the "not interested" people in society. Because these people already care about animals, there is a high chance you could educate them animal rescue etc and cause them to change their own behaviour. (Even in this animal-liking group you won't change everyone).
The same goes for forums like this. When we try to educate new members we have a high chance of success, simply because if they didn't care about animals they wouldn't be on an animal forum in the first place.
In these two scenarios we are preaching to the "already half-converted". They already care, they just need to know how to act upon it.

Now consider all the people looking for jobs. This will be a cross section of society and include all the groups I have mentioned, from the cruel and uncaring, to the people with no real interest or concern for animals, to the animal lovers, to the animal rights activists. The animal rights guys wouldn't work at a pet store. The animal lovers proabably would quite happily unless they can be educated and convinced not to. The people with no interest are not going to be convinced.

If the pet store was interviewing a potential employee I would like to think they would choose the animal lover over someone who doesn't care. But, take away the animal lover and the store will simply employ all their staff from the "don't care" group.

I honestly do not think that there are enough people in society that are educated enough and care enough to refuse to work in pet stores. Stopping animal lovers working for pet stores is never going to result in them closing because there all always other people to fill the gaps.

On the other hand, the customers are already half way there. They already care about animals, so convincing enough of them to stop buying animals is definately possible. You don't even need to convince ALL of them - just enough to make selling animals no longer viable, so as to pursuade the store not to bother selling them.

Having animal lovers working in pet stores can only be a good thing. Partly because they can improve the lives of the animals in their care. They can also educate. These people can - on the sly perhaps - recommend that people adopt from shelters. They can give links to this site (which in turn is pro-rescue). Surely its better to have an employee that will suggest rescues than one who will pressure people into buying?

I am not being defeatist.... I honestly believe that we SHOULD try to stop pet stores selling animals, and that we CAN succeed. But this is best done through the customers - not the workers. Surely, we should be trying to get more educated animal lovers into these stores where they could make a difference? Consider this - if one of us worked our way up to the top of petco or petsmart we could change company policy immediately to stop selling animals. I just think that taking the animal lovers out of the company will only make it harder to change these companies for the better.

[thalestral]

No one in working in a pet shop will make a difference, not even those at the top. To follow this line of thinking, so much energy would be spent convincing animal people to work in such places that the goal of shutting such places down gets pushed further and further away.

The only way to change such things are through campaigning for law changes and campaigning as a potential consumer to the shops directly - otherwise what goes on in ONE store is not reflective of other stores anyway. To do so as an employee of the store would smack of hypocrisy to many of those watching regardless of what category they fall into.

So one store has slightly happier animals before they are packed away in people's back gardens and hutches, what does that achieve? Are people really going to listen to the advice of someone who still advocates selling animals through their very job?

Until shops stop selling animals, until vets get their act together and until the campaigners voice is heard by both companies and governments - it's all just excuses in the meantime.

I've already asked what the people who say they work in a pet shop against their better judgement do regarding campaigning for that which they really believe in. I am interested to know how this conflicts with their job, as if they were to really use their job to get the message across they would be fired - which is the main problem I have with this whole scenario.

[Susan9608]

Having animal lovers working in pet stores can only be a good thing. Partly because they can improve the lives of the animals in their care. They can also educate. These people can - on the sly perhaps - recommend that people adopt from shelters. They can give links to this site (which in turn is pro-rescue). Surely its better to have an employee that will suggest rescues than one who will pressure people into buying?

Educate? Yes, I suppose they can ... but how seriously are they going to be taken when they're standing there in the store, surrounded by easily obtainable, but low quality, foods and cages? How seriously are they going to be taken recommending adoption when they themselves are willing to sell an animal to virtually anyone who plunks down the money.

Generally speaking, most people don't trust hypocrisy, and that's exactly what the situation you're describing is.

As I've said before, if people want to - or feel they have to - work in a pet store, that's fine. It's totally their own business. But I am so tired of those employees coming to this forum - this adamantly, openly ANTI-PETSTORE form - and insisting that by working at a pet store they are doing something wonderful for animals.

Perhaps you agree that they are doing something wonderful for animals; if that's so, then great - you're entitled to have that opinion. Some of the rest of us, though, disagree and think that by working for a pet store (or at least working for one and not taking radical steps to end the sale of live animals) then you're doing nothing but enabling bad practices to continue.

It's been conceded many, many times that yes, these employees probably take excellent care of the animals in their stores. And it's been conceded that yes, these employees can tell their customers about better foods/cages/rescues/etc. But the point is that in the grand scheme of things, none of that stuff does anything at all to halt the practice of selling animals in pet stores.

[Percy's Mom]

Originally Posted by crazywiggy

Consider this - if one of us worked our way up to the top of petco or petsmart we could change company policy immediately to stop selling animals.

Have you ever worked in retail? As someone who has, let me try to make a point here. NO ONE is going to work their way up in any retail establishment without pushing sales and meeting or exceeding sales quotas. To get to the top of petco or petsmart or any of the other animal selling pet stores, a person would have to be a cheerleader for all of the companies policies. He or she would have to sell crap products to anyone who wanted to buy them to make maximum profits and would NEVER consider discouraging someone from buying an animal in their store, because that isn't how the company wants it right now.

[mommyoffive]

Originally Posted by Susan9608

Educate? Yes, I suppose they can ... but how seriously are they going to be taken when they're standing there in the store, surrounded by easily obtainable, but low quality, foods and cages? How seriously are they going to be taken recommending adoption when they themselves are willing to sell an animal to virtually anyone who plunks down the money.

Susan have you ever worked in a petstore? Do you know what its like to work there? Do you hide around the corner and spy on employees as they talk to customers? Customers will and have listened. Early in my shift yesterday my friend and myself told a customer about the horrors of petstore puppies (she was looking to buy one) I gave her the address and the number of the animal shelter and told her to go check it out. 4 hours later she comes back with an adorable 1 year old pitbull named Lulu which was newly adopted from our shelter. There is other countless stories where customers have listened.

Some are stubborn but most are willing to listen. And that does count towards something. I dont know where your getting at when you say the "bigger picture." Its a long ways to come and everyone knows it...so these "petstore employees that are trying to do something are not going to be taken sersiously" business is getting old to me. We are trying to doing something, it may not be for the "bigger picture" in your eyes, but for our animals its certanly making a difference in their eyes.

[Susan9608]

but for our animals its certanly making a difference in their eyes.

Ah, and here you've hit upon the problem. YOUR animals. The animals YOU come in contact with. If you took into consideration all of the animals bred for, sold through, and housed in all the Petsmarts, Petcos, and other pet stores across the whole United States, how many of those animals do YOU personally come in contact with?

I'm willing to bet it's not a great percentage.

And, how many pet store employees do you think are knowledgeable like you? How many of them are out there, preaching adoption vs. purchase and better care vs. convenient care? Out of all the pet stores that sell animals in the entire United States, I bet it isn't a large number.

Which is not to say that peopl who work there don't care about animals; I'm sure they do. But the educations pet stores provide on care for their animals is woefully inadequate.

So what do you think the best idea is? Focus energy on making sure ALL pet store employees who work in pet stores that sell animals are experts in small animal care? Or trying to end the practice of selling animals in stores all together?

I know which one I think is more important.

And perhaps there are some customers who listen and take your information seriously. But again, out of all the pet stores that sell animals in the whole United States, how many individuals do you think that is? I imagine that the # of people who just go for convenience sorely outweighs those willing to listen ... which is why I believe - very strongly - that there shouldn't be an option. That is, that there shouldn't be animals available for SALE in pet stores.

[John4216]

I agree with what Susan has said. I would also like to point out that it is not the employee's that will make much of a difference either way no matter what. The truth of Pet stores is that the bottom line is profit. Not the animals well being, but profit. Things like cedar bedding, improper cage sizes and all the other things. And as long as they can make a profit off of the animals then they will continue to do so. When someone buys a petstore animal it just makes sure that more animals are used for breeding and continues the cycle. Everytime someone walks out of the store with an improper cage, no information about the pets, improper food, etc, just keeps the cycle going. Being a part of that means that in some way you help to keep that cycle going even if you do not want to admit it to yourself.

[lovepigs]

Thanks. That makes me feel good. The last pig was sold yesterday. The owners I met for the adopting.. i'm not shore about they are very poor, I told them I would do the vet bills and anything els they can't pay for. They are a great family though!

[pigsforlife]

I am thoroughly confused, I thought your mother bought the pigs from the petstore and then took them to the rescue. Normally, once an animal is at the rescue, the person that took the animals to the rescue is left alone and is not involved in the adoption process at all. I also cant understand why a rescue would allow a poor family/person to adopt guinea pigs (or any animal), the family should not have guinea pigs (or any animal) if they dont have enough money to properly care for them in my opinion.