Can neutered Peruvian males live with Teddy Females? Help!

[boarmommy]

Hello Everybody!

I am forced to find a new home for my two wonderful peruvian male piggies, I will be moving in two months time to another country for studies, I am devastated about it, but after several months of searching I found a wonderful girl who loves guinea pigs as much as I do!

The thing is that she has two Teddy females, and I have two recently neutered peruvian males (they are about two years old), my two males were neutered because of their very high hormonal levels, they were constantly chasing each other and even though more often than not they finished their business, they still will go at it, sometimes the chasing lasted for hours, and the aggression got so bad they fought once and in one second when I was about to separate them they attacked each other and both needed a couple of stitches! I kept them separated for some days, the thing is these boys cry and weep when not together, after constant monitoring i put them back together, the thing is that this "eager" behavior comes in short waves, and then they go back to their normal happy ways, my vet is a brilliant and well experienced regarding guinea pigs, she recommended the neutering to lower their intense desire, even though they will probably still mount each other, my vet told me that by neutering the hormonal level will go down and therefore they should be calmer, now I am waiting as they heal to see what happens.

Now the neutering happened just a couple of days ago, I decided to neuter the boys even though I will be giving them in adoption to someone else, I want to make sure the next person can handle them well, and the girl who would eventually take them home, would do so in the end of february, so in about month and half, I thought that during this time I will follow my piggies behavior, even though they have had their "arguments" I know these two can't live without each other, so I am hoping the lower testosterone will calm them down a bit cause the chasing for long periods is what triggers the aggression (never argue besides when "eager") but I wouldn't give them to her if their behavior remained unchanged...

The question is if introducing them to females could actually work? has anyone done this? or is it likely than even neutered they would fight to mate? also my boys are pretty big, so I am afraid for these poor girls since my boys are large peruvians and these girls are teddys also I don't think they are spayed so I dont know if that would have an impact, but it would be awesome if my boys got girlfriends I know she could have them in other cage and introduce them slowly too

I have read a bit before about the introduction period before, but I would very much appreciate some guidance about this, advice, anyone with experience is very much appreciated, I want what is best for my boys

thank you for your time and help!

Kind regards

[bpatters]

The only thing that may have changed with the neutering is that you won't have as much boar glue to deal with.

Neutering guinea pigs doesn't change their behavior. And your boys are just as likely to hump each other as they are the females. It's a dominance behavior as well as a sexual one, and if your boys are adolescents, they're going to hump everything that moves as well as some things that don't.

The short answer to whether they'll be able to get along with the females or not is that it depends on the personality of the pigs. There's absolutely no way to predict or to know in advance what will happen when you put them together. I can tell you that it will take a very large cage to even have a chance of it working.

Two males and two females together isn't the most likely pairing to work. The rule of thumb is either all males, or one male with one or more females. That's not to say that you absolutely can't get two males to live with a group of females, just that a lot of people have tried it and given up on the idea.

By the way, how big is your cage? Space has a lot to do with whether or not males can get along with fighting. One of your issues may have been that they didn't have enough room to get away from each other, not their testosterone levels.

[boarmommy]

Hello!

Thanks for your advice, their cage is about 2 square meters, I customized it for them, they spent most of their day out of the cage though,I prepare an area in my living room with fleece blankets, several hideouts,huts, food, hay, tons of veggies and so on, so I don't think space was an issue. I tried everything possible but these waves of "eagerness" come and go.. In fact one of them has figured out how to hump and satisfy himself him a puffy and plushy doggy bed, he mounts the side of it and does himself finished, but he tends to do this after getting tired of chasing my other piggie, they are almost two years old, so they are actually too old to have this behavior, and lately the intensity and frequency of it has amplified (their fight was in december)

I know how everyone says that neutering has no effect what so ever, I am very well informed about that and I was very reluctant to do so, but I did read in guinealynx and over places, and I talked to my vet who specializes in rodents and has done hundreds of neuterings with a 100% success rate, that in some cases it can help with the sexual urge also there is some health benefit aswell regarding impactation in their later life.

The problem doesn't seem to be getting along, because they do, they are brothers and have always been together, and there is no bickering other wise, the aggression comes when one of my piggies who is much more eager than the other, keeps on chasing him for a very long time and won't give up, but I have seen the difference with my piggies when they are being territorial and marking their space with their pungent scent and mounting to display leadership and when he is just chasing and desperately trying to mount the other, so I do think that removing the testicles and lower testosterone will calm down the sexual urge while keeping their normal dominant behavior, and it is nice to get rid of the glue, because they have had some funny haircuts because of it

The good thing is that the girls have a huge cage themselves, they don't have to be together, but it would be nice, I appreciate some advice about how to introduce them in the best possible way.

Thanks!

[bpatters]

Two square meters is barely enough for two males, and certainly wouldn't be nearly enough for four.

Read the Home page of this site for recommended cage sizes, and remember that bigger is always better.

Read Guinea Pigs Social Life -- the Introductions section is about halfway down.

[HolyCowBunny]

Two square meters is about 21.5 square feet, so a very large cage indeed. I can't speak as to how the four would get along, but I would think that the cage would be plenty big enough. Way back when, I had both a male guinea that we neutered so we could keep him with our female. His "male" behaviors did decrease some. Adolescence just isn't the same when you're missing your testicles.

[boarmommy]

HAHAHA! Gosh I laughed hard and loud with that last line! Thank you so much! I really used a lot of time and effort researching all the options before I decided to do the neutering. I am truly hopeful that they will calm down a bit, I will let you guys know what happens and I will keep track of their behavior in the coming weeks, and I will do inform myself as much as possible before I do any trial introduction. Thank you!

[lissie]

I'm sorry you have to give them up. You sound like a wonderful owner. I hope the intro goes well. Since you just had them neutered, you'd have to wait 2 - 3 weeks before the intro.

[bpatters]

I'm sorry, I misread the "two square meters." That is indeed large enough for two boars, and maybe some others.

That's what I get for reading this forum before my coffee is ready...

[boarmommy]

No worries, thank you so much for all your advice! The boys are doing ok after the surgery although I am keeping a close watch over them, there it will definitely be at least a month before she takes them home I will post later on about their behavior post-op.

[Onetwo]

Just give them a good 3 weeks for all the sperm to die off before getting them anywhere near the female guinea pigs. You don't want any accidents.

It sounds like they were just being boys. Boys tend to chase more, nip more and are more active. They don't know any different social structure and this is how theirs is. I'll bet they would have settled down after a few years without being fixed. But its done now. Its perfectly normal for guinea pigs to hump many multipel times a day. I know mine seems to do it every hour to his cage mate and he is 4 years old. Just keep that in mind when you intro them to the females.

[boarmommy]

Yeah, the thing was that my boys didn't do that in daily basis, the only did it in waves, maybe it would last for 12 hours almost none stop, taking only short break to eat or sleep, and this waves would come only once every few months or so, it wasn't their normal behavior, they are two years old, the only time it was like this it was when they were very small (I got them when they were two months old) and their "teen" stage, they never had this behavior and always got along great, and then their last waved lasted for several weeks and ended up with them fighting because one wouldn't stop bothering the other one, I know how everyone claims that neutering has no effect in their behavior, and I do believe also that it wouldn't help is aggression is the problem, BUT that was not the reason, it was because I do believe that less testosterone will most definitely help calm down the sexual urge, not eliminate it, but at least lower it a bit, cause it was the intensity that triggered the aggression, not the behavior itself. They got 7 days worth of pain killers, a round with mild, preventive antibiotics and I think its great to know that now I wouldnt have to worry about them suffering from impactation in the future, so that is an upside, of course it's important to not do an unnecessary procedure, but this will definitely improve their quality of life if it makes the sexual urge calmer, and it's proven than some guinea pigs do calm down, so the procedure shouldn't be demonized, because I think it was the right choice for them I will keep updates about their behavior in the coming weeks when their testosterone goes down.

[boarmommy]

Hello Everybody, I just wanted to give an update about Gnuk and Caramelo, the neutering was the best decision I could do for them! They have completely changed their behaviour!!!! I was so sure that their aggression towards each other came as the result of hours of chasing each other to "mate" or "mount" each other, I don't know about other guinea pigs, but it has been over a month now since the neutering and they have both calmed down! They are much more happy now, the hump each other still, but just for a few seconds, as normal dominance display, but not like they used to before, also they are pop corning all the time now, and are generally more stable and happy, they have not chattered their teeth not even once since! They always got along great, until they got their "eager waves" now their quality of life has improved 100% for the better, so even though neutering does not change aggressive behaviour, in this case it did because the aggression was caused because of their high testosterone levels make them too eager to mate, so neutering can be the answer for some guinea pigs!

[Frapplove]

Yay! I'm glad it worked out for them