C&C: Parents won't let me make a C&C Cage?

[sdpiggylvr]

Please help - I presented the idea to my parents about making a C&C cage and they said no. And they're NOT budging.
How can I convince them? My poor pigs live in a small 48" x 24" pet store cage and frankly they're overweight, bored, and unhappy. I can tell ... but they can't. My parents think the pigs are just fine in their cage and that their behavior won't change if they live in a C&C. I am in despair! I really badly want to make a C&C cage for them, but my parents strongly disbelieve a C&C will be better.
They also think the whole towel/fleece bedding idea is disgusting and unsanitary. How can I convince them otherwise?
I even offered to pay for the C&C cage with my own money. But they still say NO. I'm so angry, I don't know how to convince them. They say that "some people have Ferrari's and Mazaratti's, and some peole have sedans and other regular cars. Our guinea pigs have just a regular car and they're just fine. A C&C cage is not going to make their lives any better." (Those are exact words, by the way.)
Please help me convince them! It seems impossible.

[javim121]

That is too bad. Have you told them you can sell the cage to make the money for the bigger cage. What is the main reason for not wanting something larger? Are they worried about space? If they do not want the liners, then sticking to aspen is not bad, just more wasteful and not very green.

[lissie]

48"x24" is not that bad if that's the measurement from inside. That's 8 sq.ft and meets the minimum cage size.
If you feel they are bored, you can give them more floor time. You can also rearrange things in their cage to keep them interested.

[blackarrow]

OK, first things first. As ferndalezoo pointed out in a different thread today, there really is no law that C&C cage users have to use fleece. It makes zero sense to me that there are parents who think it's unsanitary to wash and reuse something that's been soaked in pee, because there isn't a parent in the world who has gotten through the baby years with their kids WITHOUT much of their bedding and all their kids' wardrobes and about half their OWN wardrobe peed on, pooped on and thrown up on by the little shavers (sometimes within the same hour!), and you know they learned to clean it off and move on. BUT, if they're OK with other bedding, they're OK with other bedding, and that's one point on which you can compromise.

I wonder if you might be able to get grids and ziptie them and a tarp or shower curtain and have them out on that for a number of hours a day - that is, I wonder if it's the perceived hassle of building something and the seeming permanence of it that's at least part of the issue for your parents? I know it was a big surprise to my husband that they would need a playpen when their cage was "that big" but then again, his only experience with cavies was with a college roommate's elderly, obese, solo pig who did nothing but sit and eat (because what else was there for him to do?) Now that he sees they DO explore and run around and popcorn and chat with each other, he gets it that what he thought was "normal pig" was "depressed and bored pig". Maybe you could ease your parents into it that way.

I understand what they're saying about the Ferrari, etc., but they've got the comparison wrong. It's not that what you're asking for is something expensive and luxury - it IS what's basic. The best comparisons I've heard are along the line of that since a pair of human beings COULD live in a 5x10 jail cell, it would be perfectly OK to expect everyone to do so. I'm sure I'm not telling YOU anything new by saying that keeping someone or something alive is not the same thing as providing reasonable care.

I'm very sorry it isn't going more smoothly for you. One thing I have to say for your parents is that they're raising a caring, responsible child. I do hope they give you the opportunity to demonstrate that.

[Katie_Kutthroat]

I understand where your coming from. My mom seemed to think that the guinea pig is happy in his 1x2ish cage because thats all she ever saw a rodent in. I explained to her that in a bigger cage he would get more exercise and encourage me to clean my room because I would have to rearrange everything to make sure I had enough space. I showed her the pictures of the cages on here and she still seems to think that it wouldn't make a difference but as long as I'm paying for it, I keep it crazy clean and it's in my room she doesn't care. She also think the fleece thing is gross but as I said she views it as my problem.

Maybe if you promise them to keep it clean and find the space for it? And if they don't like how it works out for a couple of weeks then say you'll switch back.

[lissie]

sdpiggylvr, what is the brand of the cage you're using? 48"x24" is not small at all. I'm wondering if it's Midwest cage. If it is, it's big enough.

[JD In Van]

Unfortunitely, this is once again another example of why parents need to be 100% on board with and understanding of the purchase and care of pets.

sdpiggylvr - are you able to pay for everything? Will that change your parent's additude if you offer to?

[Duffinvt]

If your parents will let you buy the grids you can use a coupon and get them at Bed, Bath and Beyond they will be $11 +/-. Then zip tie the grids and make a fold-up enclosure that you can put over an old shower curtain or Dollar Store plastic tablecloth. Let them exercise in this, in your room or other acceptable place with cardboard boxes, oatmeal boxes and such for exploration. They will at least have floor time and a change of scenery ! If your folks won't let you buy the grids, I guess you could make a play space out of cardboard taped together to make an enclosure.

[distancel]

My parents were very strict with me too. It's just one of those things I guess. You don't want to get in trouble by keeping pressing the subject too much as that will probably make it worse if they're anything like mine were.

But, maybe you could print out some info about how big guinea pig cages should be and let them read it? Then again some people have said your cage may be big enough anyway, if those are the measurements of the inside space.

I think the playpen idea is a good one, maybe they wouldn't object to that, I mean if it is put away between uses I couldn't see the harm in it. But then again, parents can be unpredictable hey. Hope it works out for you though.

[guineaswineflu]

I had the same problem as you did for a time, but I... sorta did it behind my parents' backs. Built a C&C cage, that is. The thing is I had lots of project on coroplast, and so did my friends, so I basically stole coroplast from everyone and taped it all together. For the grids, I bought and used barbecue grill from the supermarket. The barbecue grill can sorta bend too, so I just bought like four big pieces, and it cost about... 15 US dollars?

Why my parents changed their minds was because they saw how happy the pigs were, so they were all "okay, let's buy grids now", so now I have a full-fledged C&C cage =)

I don't know whether you can build a cage with just 15 dollars, but it's true, your cage is big enough. Fleece isn't really a must either (though I also managed to bring my parents' minds around that, because my mum's obsessively eco-friendly and hates the idea of using virgin wood pulp as bedding). If your pigs are bored/obese, maybe more floor time and cardboard toys is the way to go!

[fieryone]

I agree that building them a playpen for floor time is a great first step. Let your parents see how much happier they are when they are allowed to stretch out and explore instead of just sit in a small cage all day. Although I also agree that if the measurements you quoted are correct, it sounds like an okay sized cage.

[1frankie7]

first of all how many pigs do you have 1... 2...3? Because if you have one then your cage is big enough if you have 2 then its cutting close but your still okay and if 3 or more then you need a bigger cage of course bigger is always better. I say just say it again I will use my own money. Do you pay for the pigs yourself or are they more family pets because if they are family pets then your parents should read up on guinea pigs the care of guinea pigs. show them www.guineapigcages.com and www.cavyspirit.com and just hope they understand.

[ferndalezoo]

I am a mom of teenagers, and threads like this always make me a little sad. It is, as JD in Van said, yet another example of how parents and kids don't always think things through before getting a pet. Everyone in the family (parents and kids alike) need to be on board before bringing a pet into the home. But what's done is done.

first things first:

*DON'T go behind your parents' back. That isn't going to help the situation, and will just make them angry. It will also make it look like you can't or won't follow rules.

* SHOW them the home page of this website, especially the testimonials page.

* ASK them if you can build a playpen for your pigs that you can set up and take down, for their floortime, etc. As suggested, that might help ease them into the idea.

*COMPROMISE on the bedding, at least for now. There is no rule that you have to use fleece. Some people find that it works well, others find that a disposable bedding (I use aspen, mostly, now) works better. You need to concentrate on just the cage situation right now. The rest can come later.

*SHOW them that you can care for a bigger cage. Be sure you're cleaning the current one regularly. Save up money so you can show them that you already have the funds to purchase what you need for the new one. Look up what cages similar to your current one are selling for on Craigslist, for example, to show them that it wasn't a wasted purchase.

[sdpiggylvr]

The 48" x 24" cage is TWO pet store cages connected...but it's really a bit smaller because those dimensions are the outside. The cage size is ok, but not the best it could be. So that's why I really want a C&C Cage for my pigs. Thanks for all your help, by the way, guys! I think I'll eventually be able to convince them.
And, I can pay for EVERYTHING...it's just that they don't want me to "waste my money on extra things" when "there are plenty of other useful things I could by on other more important things".
I do not pay for their monthly supplies, only extra veggies beyond the romaine lettuce, celery and carrots my parents buy. I feel like I am being very reasonable here, so I do not understand why they say no.
The reaons I love the fleece idea is that it's so mess-free! No changing the urine soaked bedding, no cleaning the bottom of the feces-smeared cage. It's so easy! It's more eco-friendly too. It was a big drawback for them about the urine-soaked towels in the washing machine idea, I guess...but I offered to hand wash the towels. Sigh. Nothing changes their mind!

[ferndalezoo]

It's all in your perspective. In my cage, fleece turned out to be a problem. It smelled much sooner (I have 4 boars), and was costing a lot as far as my water and electric bills.

In any case, if compromising on THAT will help your cause with regard to the cage, I'd suggest giving it some thought.

[distancel]

About the fleece - disposable bedding can be almost as good to use too if you put plenty of newspaper underneath it to line the cage, cage cleaning is a lot easier and it shouldn't leave any mess on the bottom of the cage. I like fleece because it looks so nice and tidy, compared to other beddings, but my girls are avid burrowers and getting it washed and dried really is costing me a fair with laundromat bills! So you never know you may actually prefer disposable in the long run.

My step dad said I couldn't get a rat when I was 16. My mum wanted one but wanted to abide by him. Well I went and got ratties behind their backs. My mum loved them so much she let me keep them but it really was not a good thing to do. My step dad's not a bad guy but at the time I thought he was just trying to make my life miserable (don't a lot of kids though) but really he just wanted me to show some respect to him which I never did. Soo yeah probably don't go behind their backs. I had so many fights with my step dad in the years that followed. There was a lot of 'I don't want you keeping those rats in your room!!'

Then one day he surprised me and he built me an enormous cage for my ratties, that I could keep in the spare room. It wasn't the fact he didn't want me to be happy he just wanted things his way.

[guineaswineflu]

I'm not encouraging you to do it behind your parents' backs, really. I think you do know the underlying issue to why you can't get a C&C cage, it's because your 'rents think that it's a waste of money. And maybe it is, because your cage IS big enough.

About the fleece, actually, it can get really faeces-smeared too, and I clean out mine like twice a day. That sometimes angers my parents because they think I'm wasting time cleaning cages. I don't know whether the high maintenance of fleece will anger your parents too, but what I'm saying is that if you do get fleece and spend a lot of time on it, they'd think you're wasting time, and insist on changing back to bedding.

But again, don't be too demanding, because maybe the problem of your pigs being obese and bored doesn't lie in the cage, but the problem lies in lack of floor time and toys.

[lissie]

Originally Posted by sdpiggylvr

The 48" x 24" cage is TWO pet store cages connected...but it's really a bit smaller because those dimensions are the outside. The cage size is ok, but not the best it could be. So that's why I really want a C&C Cage for my pigs.

I totally understand why you want a C&C cage. The two pet store cage you are using probably don't give enough room for the pigs. At first I thought it was a different type of cage that provide enough space. If your parents don't want C&C because they don't want you to spend money, how about keep the pigs free-range in your bedroom? You can use the store cage as their kitchen. You'll have to piggy proof your room though.

Originally Posted by sdpiggylvr

The reasons I love the fleece idea is that it's so mess-free! No changing the urine soaked bedding, no cleaning the bottom of the feces-smeared cage. It's so easy! It's more eco-friendly too. It was a big drawback for them about the urine-soaked towels in the washing machine idea, I guess...but I offered to hand wash the towels.

I don't know what type of bedding you're using. But if you spot clean everyday, it shouldn't be urine soaked. Also, wood pellets as the bottom layer under shavings or carefresh would help too.
With fleece, you'll have to scoop out poop once or twice a day. It's a high maintenance bedding, some people like it, some people don't. It's all about personal preference. Remember, you don't have to switch to fleece to use C&C. Many people use other types of bedding.

[JD In Van]

Originally Posted by guineaswineflu

About the fleece, actually, it can get really faeces-smeared too, and I clean out mine like twice a day.

If your piggies are having a lot of smeared feces they need to go to the vet. Piggie poops should fairly firm and not very smeary.

As for urine soaked towels, I have two little litters in my cage and increasingly the boys are getting better about using them. The towels are rarely urine soaked.

[sdpiggylvr]

"If your piggies are having a lot of smeared feces they need to go to the vet. Piggie poops should fairly firm and not very smeary."

No, I mean the feces are firm and not smeary, they just end up that way once I clean everything out, making a mess. I don't do it on purpose, it just happens. Their feces are the way they should be.

By the way, I don't spot clean because I don't have the time. I just clean the cage every four-five days.